Hi, my name is TJ Glosser, I'm an assistant coach for the Corning Hawks Track Team in Corning NY. In Indoor and Outdoor Track I specialize and work with the long and triple jumpers. I've been only coaching for a few years, but I have done a lot of research and I truly try to learn as much about the jumps I can. I have learned a lot just reading a lot of the past posts in the amazing forums here on elitetrack.
Ok, the reason for my post. I have a male athlete who is 16 years old and is a junior this year. This year in indoor track he jumped 23'1/2" to win the NY State Championships. He also came in 4th in the triple jump with a 46'4" jump. I feel he has so much more potential in each event as well. We are working on his techniques in the triple jump and I expect him to be up to 48' by the championship season in outdoors this season. I'm sure I'll have some questions later in Triple, but my question today is HOW TO YOU TEACH THE PENULTIMATE STEP IN THE LONG JUMP.
The kid I'm referring to above name is AJ. I know two of the most important aspects of the long jump are the approach and the takeoff. AJ has great speed down the runway. He can run about a 6.8 in the 55,11.6ish in the 100 and 22.8 in the 200. We have been working a lot on his approach and there is not a lot of problems right now with consistency and things are working well. The problem I'm having is teaching the penultimate step. I've thought about teaching him to count his steps (he has a 9 step approach, right foot), but I think this might be too much for him and he could loose his consistency in the approach. I'm still willing to try it though; I'm just wondering is there other things to teach the penultimate that I could be doing. I really want to convert his consistent horizontal speed to vertical. I believe if I can, he can consistently jump over 23' and could maybe even hit 24'. AJ also has great form in his flight of the LJ, he has a hang style has seems to keep it well in the air and counterbalances his forward rotation well with his flight. The penultimate step is key element for his future success.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility - Ben Parker
If my athletes have trouble with the penultimate step, I usually put a piece of tape down about 6' (you can calcuate a precise length based on greater trochanter length) back from the board to make sure their last step is shorter than a normal stride. You watch the tape mark so you can see the distance of their last stride on each jump. A shorter last stride should also give them the desired cadence going into takeoff.
Also remember that there are many ways to jump far. Bob Beamon's takeoff step was bigger than any other step.
Might I suggest that with a 23' LJ and an 11.6 100m (11.85 if the 11.6 is hand timed) that there may be bigger fish to fry here?
However poor the PE system in the US, kids invariably know that to jump, one must lower first.
My experience for what its worth, is the more one starts to speak to and purposefully coach the penultimate, the more trouble comes up…
I am with coachformer. In my heyday, I jumped 23-1. Never ran the 100, but 200 time was 22.9 and I thought my long jump was pretty good for my speed. From 22.9, I would guess my 100 would have been around 11.3. If your boy jumps 23 off an 11.6 100, I'd say he's a very good jumper and you should be working on his speed more than his technique.
Thanks for your advice. I know that 23 feet is a great jump for someone his age and speed, I'm just trying to do everything I can to help him continue to succeed at the Long jump and thought the penultimate step might be the missing factor or at least could be improved.
It is kind of hard for me to come up with things to improve his long jump. Currently once a week we are working on explosive training in the weight room and another day we are working on plyos and technique stuff. The rest of the week consists of a one day is a pool workout, one day is usually a meet, and the last day is usually a speed workout and approach work. I have a lot of drills I do for the triple jump, but I can't seem to come up with much for the long jump. That is why I thought the penultimate drills would be helpful.
Do you guys think that if he gets faster he will jump farther? Is the equation that simple. I'm just wondering, I know that when more horizontal speed is obtained that more speed usually results in longer jumps, I have witnessed this many time in my short coaching career. Doesn't the speed need to be controlled though.
How fast is too fast?
If my kid can run an 11.6 now and can jump 23 feet, if his time improves in the 100 do you think he will jump farther? I have no problem working on him improving his speed. I really just want to figure out what we should focus on when it comes to his long jump work. He is only a junior and I truly feel he could win the long jump title (and the triple for that matter) in this years outdoor states and next years state meets as well. He also has intentions of jumping in college and I'd love to help it get looked at by a division one track program if he keep improving.
Any advice is welcomed, sorry for the long post. I just love the jumps and could talk them all day.
TJ
WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY - BEN PARKER
Coach Glosser, I have very limited experience here, but I'd like to chip in my 2 cents.
Last year, I ran a 12.1 FAT 100M and I LJ'ed about 17'. Since then, I've gotten much faster and would put my 100M at just under 11.0 seconds given a couple weeks to just get out on the track and sprint after a long Alaska winter. Today, in my warmups for tempo, I let my curiosity get the best of me and took a couple of long jumps. Mind you, I was not warmed up and was wearing normal athletic shoes, not spikes. I jumped 19'9". Not only did I just wing my approach, but I haven't jumped in nearly a year. So, IMO, speed is the prime factor behind LJ improvements for most.
Judging from the stats for your athlete, he is a very good jumper for his speed. Any additional speed you gain with him will probably transfer over in jumping distance. So, hammer those flying 20s and I would guess his distance would increase.
I agree that speed is key for long jump. However, I have seen cases where an athlete gained speed (as measured by 60m/100m competitions) and lost distance on his long jump. Both technique and speed are very important so don't totally abandon one to chase the other.
There is a guy on my team that is legit under 7fat in the 60m and he barely breaks 20ft on a good day, so I don't think speed is everything if you cannot control yourself down the runway or if you hesitate.
More speed will make you jump farther if your technique remains the same. That is just a matter of physics, not opinion. If your guy jumps 23 off an 11.6 he is a very good jumper whose penultimate step must be good or he couldn't jump so far. If it ain't broke don't try to fix it, and it seems as though it aint broke. Work on speed and power. If his technique starts breaking down, then you can start to worry.
I "coach" a tiny 14-year-old who is only 5' tall and jumps in the mid 17s. I put "coach" in quotation marks because he is such a natural that about all I have to do is give him an activity to do and then let him do it. I have improved his landings a bit, but that's about it. I only work with him a half dozen times each spring because he is a superstar soccer player who is practicing that all the time. He has no other track coach. His parents think I'm a genius. The kid makes coaching so easy that it doesn't feel like I am doing anything. But coaching does not consist of changing things just to show that you know something.
Not too sure about the 100m time thing…the 100m time and jump distance is not correlated well for many good jumpers…I cant break 11.2 in the 100m. I know many 8m + guys who dont break 10.7 in the 100m but who can run 10.7mps on the runway.
About the penultimate. My coach always states that you shouldnt teach the it because it often causes the jumper to sink too much on take off. He seems to be a natural jumper, therefore i would be suprised if his take off and penultimate isnt already pretty good. The key is to be able to keep doing that when he gets faster on the runway. There are a few connecting exercises we do, which the aim to connect the speed to the take off. Example would be alternate bounding from a 30cm box to another 30cm box but running fast onto the first box. The progression for this would be to start with no running steps and slowly add them.
Jumperuk— I do agree about 100M times and LJ distances not correlating exactly. 100M times don't just reflect top speed but also reaction time, block technique and power, acceleration. Obviously what counts for LJ is speed at the board, not how fast you can get from one end of the runway to the other. My guess is your speed at the board is pretty darn fast and that your comparatively poor 100 time reflects what happens at the beginning of that race, not your max velocity.
Hey guys, AJ jumped today in both the long jump and triple jump. The weather was decent, but still kind of chilly, so I think is ability to stay loose and warm was affected a little. He also ran in the 4x100 relay and the open 200.
He jump 21"10.5 (and three more time over 21'6) in the long jump and 45'8" was is best in the triple. His speed down the runway was definitely not as fast as it could be. His mark was off a little and he slowed down a bit at the board. I'm going to work on getting his marks really on this week with more speed. We have a scrimmage on Tuesday so I'm hoping on Monday I can get his mark right with the faster speed and see if things improve. As the season progresses I will continue to work on developing his runway speed.
I've been thinking about what things I should be having him do to improve his runway speed.
I'm thinking multiple short sprints about 30meters. His approach in both events is between 105-110 feet with two bounding steps to start the approach, so actually running strides is about 95 feet. This comes out to about 30 meters give or take. What do you all think about other ways to develop top speed on the runway. How much 100m, 200 meter type stuff should he be doing. A popular workout we have the kids do is 150-75's. Where the kids run 150meters at about 80%, then back 75meters all out after one minute rest. WE usually do about 4-6 of these.
Any advice is appreciated, I just ordered about 300 dollars worth of Boo (LSU) tapes and books so I'm looking forward to getting those this week.
Thanks again,
Coach Glosser
WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY - BEN PARKER
I've been thinking about what things I should be having him do to improve his runway speed…His approach in both events…with two bounding steps to start the approach
Suggestion: Lose the "two bounding steps" It's stylistic at best. Not functional.
Readers of this, don't ring in with "neural activation" as support for a bounding start.
If CNS stim is needed, then warm up wasn't sufficient or do something prior to stepping on the runway.
Thanks for your advice, I've tried to get rid of the bounds from his approach but it is really a security blanket for him. He used to do a lot more bounds like 4 or 5 total bounds before his run, but I nipped them down to only two.
What did you mean my neural activation, can an athlete not stimulate this neural activation with a bounding start?
If I let him keep the bounds in, which I think I really have to because he states they help him get a rhythm going when he does his approach, how long or how many steps should the drive phase, acceleration phase, holding phase be?
I've also been working on a checkmark system for him to use during his approach but it hasn't been easy yet.
Thanks
WITH GREAT POWER COMES GREAT RESPONSIBILITY - BEN PARKER
For runway speed development, lots of repeats of a little longer than approach length. Forget the 150's etc…do 10-12 runs over say 40m, full recovery and very fast…his approach speed will increase. Also, alternate one run up and one sprint, the goal is to be faster on approach than on the track.
