Elitetrack: Sport Training & Conditioning

would someone please tell me what is the difference between the Coe and lynard systems for training for the 800 meters? What workouts are involved?

"Lydiard is on record as saying that all 800m runners should build up to 160km a week of steady running and to hold it at that level for 10 weeks. This is then followed by six weeks of fartlek hill running every other day, where the athlete ascends the hill (preferably a long one) with a high-knee raise action landing on the ball of the foot; once at the summit of the hill the athlete jogs to a point 400m away, turns around and runs back fast down the hill; once at the bottom he continues to run fast to a point 400m away, and then starts another ascent. The total number of ascents is built up to 10k. The following three months is spent acquiring speed which includes running the actual 800m distance at different efforts, for example, three-quarters effort is 10 seconds slower than oneâ??s best for the distance and would appear as 4 x 800m three-quarters effort with 800m jog. Half effort would be a further 10 seconds addition e.g. 8 x 800m 1/2 effort with 400m jog recovery."

"However, the well-known coach and athletics writer, Karikosk (Estonia), tried the Lydiard method with Soviet athletes and reported a decline in actual performance, and stated that athletes possessing superior speed (44 â?? 46 secs/400m), were 'psychologically and physiologically unsuited to long steady running and unhappy at being away from speed work for long spells'."

"Coeâ??s approach to the 800m training cycle was that training had to include work at 1,500 pace, and since he always trained at paces above and below pace, his cycle involved in the summer:

Day 1
3k pace â?? 60% aerobic â?? 3 x 1,500 3 mins rest
Day 2
1 hour fast run at half-marathon speed (94% aerobic)
Day 3
800m pace â?? 4 x 400 in 52 secs with 3 mins rest (67% Anaerobic)
Day 4
45 mins run steady run (98% aerobic)
Day 5
1500 pace â?? 4 x 800 in 1:54 with 3 mins rest (50% aerobic).
Day 6
Rest
Day 7
30 mins acceleration run (10 min slow, 10 mins steady, 10 mins fast) (90% aerobic)
Day 8
400m pace â?? 1 x 350, 1 x 300, 1 x 250, 1 x 200, full-out, walk 400m recovery (83% Anerobic)
Day 9
1 hour fast run (94% aerobic)
Day 10
5k pace â?? 5 x 1k in 2 mins 40 secs with 45 secs rest (80% aerobic).
Day 11
45 mins steady run (98% aerobic)
Day 12
Start day 1 again

It will be noted that Coe appears to have realised that he did not possess super 400m speed, and compensated for this by severe aerobic work. He was virtually able to run two 800s back to back in 1:53.5 to record a 3 mins 47.33 mile. However, he confessed that he could run 47 secs for 400m at anytime of the year."

Howrill, Frank. Solving the 800m puzzle. Serpentine Running Club.
<http://www.serpentine.org.uk/advice/coach/fh52.php>

Both Coe and Kipketer ran open 400 times in the mid 46’s.  That is the speed required to attain WR 800 pace.

Ok this is controversial but im going to say it anyway.  my old coach used to run with Snell and was friends with him...and he said that Snell probably never ran 100 miles in a week EVER!!! not for 10 weeks, not ever. He used to lie to Lydiard about the mileage that he did. Sure he did some huge miles, but never the 100 that Lydiard thought he did.

Why not post your coaches name so we can investigate this. 

His name is Dave, from New Zealand, and he lives just west of Auckland where all of Lydiards boys trained. Snell will know him. Tell Snell that when he came back to NZ a while ago he told Dave that he had put on weight, that will jog his memory.

Does anybody know the right method that Lydiart teached about ins and outs ? was it a 45m sprint all out, then 55m fly, or walk, or jog ?
There method of going up hills by bounching and that for 800m ? That looks almost impossible. I have a picture where you can see Baillie magee and friend going up smootly, easy, knee's high, but relaxed, but i dont know exactly the method. Does someone knows more of it ?

My understanding of Coe's format - the 10 day training, that only occurred after an initial base phase.  I will try and find more info on both, but it probably the same as everybody else gets.

[quote author=DMA link=topic=1363.msg52074#msg52074 date=1181261934]
My understanding of Coe's format - the 10 day training, that only occurred after an initial base phase.  I will try and find more info on both, but it probably the same as everybody else gets.

Coe wasn't a huge mileage fan, so it's not the same as others, especially lydiard's 100m compared to Coe's 100km maximum and I believe he had seb doing 80km which is 50m that's a 38m and 50m difference or 5-7 miles per day of the week.  Enough volume for aerobic base for race distances of 800 and 1500m.  According to Coe, the key was 5k pace in training for workouts.