Elitetrack: Sport Training & Conditioning

Age: 16
Training Yrs: 1-1/4
PB: HS/17'2", Club/18'0.25"

Nice video clip.  For such a young athlete, she has posted some pretty decent jumps.  From the video, however, it looks like she needs to prep for landing sooner.  Penultimate and takeoff looked ok but the hitch kick may not be for her.  I liked Mike's opinion that unless a jumper (male or female) is going in the range of 20 feet at least, the hitch style is probably the wrong idea.  As this athlete matures and gains more strength, her distances will increase and she can perfect the hitch.  Adding to this, I feel that unless an athlete can perform at least a full 1 1/2 h.k. proficiently, he/she is taking away from the entire end of the jump, thus taking away a quality landing and precious inches ++ .

This athlete def. has potential. Although I agree with the idea of not using the hitch kick until you can jump 20 feet it seems like she has mastered it rather well.
I would like to comment on her approach. It seems like her arms (hands) are not getting full range of motion. Her hands should be up near her cheeks but yet are not even pssing by her shoulders. I feel that this is affecting her speed and posture prior to and during takeoff.

Originally posted by jumpscoachmike....it looks like she needs to prep for landing sooner.  Penultimate and takeoff looked ok but the hitch kick may not be for her….

I certainly concur with the former.  And in a way, directly relates to the latter point.  However, I'm not so sure that what we see from her is a hitchkick in practice.

While the left leg extends, the right appears passive.  They both tuck under from the peak and sweep around.  Unlike her original coach! 

Aside though, she doesn't "finish" (arms & feet) the jump (landing), going back to your point.  So, elimination of the "left leg rotation"?  What might it look like?

Appreciate the input, jumpscoachmike.

What the jumper in the video is doing is not quite a full hitch kick. I would also agree that she doesn't have enough flight time to get her feet in position for landing. At 18 feet, a simple hang technique might be her best bet.

It's tough to really comment on the penultimate step because the sampling rate on that video is so low that we miss a lot of what is actually going on. It does look like she is lowering a little bit PRIOR to penultimate touchdown rather than after it. If this is the case, this would definitely be something she'd want to work on.

One big thing I do notice though is that it looks like the takeoff foot makes contact with the ground quite a ways in front of the center of mass. It looks like she really reaches her takeoff foot out in front of her. If this is the case in real life (as opposed to a low quality vid) this costs her more than any flight or landing problems.

Originally posted by QUIKAZHELL....I would like to comment on her approach. It seems like her arms (hands) are not getting full range of motion. Her hands should be up near her cheeks but yet are not even pssing by her shoulders. I feel that this is affecting her speed and posture prior to and during takeoff.

Quick, you are correct.  Prior to this year, her coaches kept her in events (XC, 800, etc.) where sprint training was non-existent.  This past season, she was able to go under 13s (100m), which I believe was due to more concentrated alactic work.  However, sprint mechanics and mental prep remain major focus areas.

Since the video is deemed insufficient, I won't show the differences in the initial steps (from simple cues) in this same work session.  However, your points are right on.  With regard to approach, I assume with improved arm action, you can also see better leg rotation?

Mike: The "toeboard reach" is something we have been working on since I began coaching her.  This occurs for the most part when she is isn't diligent in working her checkmark.  Patience and continued study should correct this.

Any advice on curing the "fear of descent"?  Again, thanks all for the input.

definitely not a hitch, i call it a modified hang. it is seen by some of the european women and i think it is effective in controlling rotation, but also sets up position of landing which keeps COM higher on landing.

question—is this short or full approach jump?

i'd worry more about her set up before the landing, one tends to take care of the other. a foot in center of COM will-
1) slow horizontal velocity
2) cause COM to be raised prematurely

those two aspects alone will translate into problems done with the jump and then down the road with landing.

nice job rotating free leg down off of take off.

Todd-these are good points.  Obviously, when I spoke about the landing issues I seemed to neglect that all things that set-up a jumper for landing-runway, transition, take-off, etc. all directly affect this final point of the jump.

And to Price, I think you bring up an excellent point regarding this athlete and her sometimes lack of diligence in practicing her checkmarks.  This is such a critical focus for a jumper, and obviously a lack of focus here will certainly show us what will happen at the board!!:yes:
I myself have a couple athletes whom I work with day in and day out regarding the importance of mastering their runway mark(s).

Originally posted by todd
....question—is this short or full approach jump?

Todd, the jump shown was from a medium (9-step) approach.  She uses a 17-step approach in competition.

Concerning her jump style, she came upon it on her own.  I believe it is what she interprets from the hitchkick.  I looked at some prior video of her and found several instances of that "leg sweeping" (for lack of a better description) action.

Is the free leg rotation helping her to extend the hips or is it really necessary?

jumpscoachmike, regarding checkmarks, I started the indoor season with two (step 2 and step 7).  After some placement adjustments and relative success, I removed step 7 from her meet setup.  Disaster!  Though we worked it in practice, my 2 athletes were all over the place during competition.

Shortly, after putting it back in and "fussing" (girls) with "getting on the mark", they began a series of progressive PB's.  My questions are:

(1) Though I use them for reference, when do you begin pulling the marks away from the athlete?  I do realize that there may be a certain maturity value to this question.

(2) Besides reminding athletes to maintain "a hips tall" posture throughout the post acceleration phase (which I believe is a major cause and effect with this athlete), are there other cues, training tools, etc. that you might recommend?

(3) And lastly, given that this athlete is extremely inexperienced, despite her better than average physical qualities, how would you begin sequencing the remedial actions?  Style vs. specific influencing points (e.g. controlled reckless abandonment on the runway) or structuring each phase independently with immediate corrective action vs. working the "whole" and selecting areas based on degrees of importance?

Again thanks to all that have responded.  Every point has been and continues to be reviewed and catalogued for continual study.  It's what I own this athlete!;)

(2) Besides reminding athletes to maintain "a hips tall" posture throughout the post acceleration phase (which I believe is a major cause and effect with this athlete), are there other cues, training tools, etc. that you might recommend?

Some of the cues i use are…
Back flat, stand tall, arms arms arms.
Also keep reminding your athlete to drive that knee.

Originally posted by Price
(1) Though I use them for reference, when do you begin pulling the marks away from the athlete?  I do realize that there may be a certain maturity value to this question.

I don't think you have to get rid of them unless you're finding the athletes are focusing too much attention on them. If so, just put marks down and tell them not to bother looking and then you can still use them as a backup to your initial impressions of the approach distribution.

(2) Besides reminding athletes to maintain "a hips tall" posture throughout the post acceleration phase (which I believe is a major cause and effect with this athlete), are there other cues, training tools, etc. that you might recommend?

Step over the opposite knee (except for last 2 steps).....I've noticed a lot of kids lower the knee recovery far before the setup for takeoff which costs them speed.

(3) And lastly, given that this athlete is extremely inexperienced, despite her better than average physical qualities, how would you begin sequencing the remedial actions?  Style vs. specific influencing points (e.g. controlled reckless abandonment on the runway) or structuring each phase independently with immediate corrective action vs. working the "whole" and selecting areas based on degrees of importance?

It's probably not a good idea to give more than 2 instructions for a given movement or sequence and you probably don't want to give 2 different instructions for things occuring at the same time. Taking that into consideration, you can divide the approach into its phases and tackle one problem in one or two of the phases until they are good enough to move on to another problem.

you mentioned this was 9 step short approach.  we can see her coming out of 4th step into 5thstep in the video clip you have given us.  my .02 is that she should still be coming out of push mechanics at step 4.  in short approach jumps there is tendency at times not to build momentum into the approach and things suffer at the board because of it.  two specifically being the penultimate that your looking for and also just plain being on the board.

"Is the free leg rotation helping her to extend the hips or is it really necessary?"

yes and yes to both.

(3) And lastly, given that this athlete is extremely inexperienced, despite her better than average physical qualities, how would you begin sequencing the remedial actions? Style vs. specific influencing points (e.g. controlled reckless abandonment on the runway) or structuring each phase independently with immediate corrective action vs. working the "whole" and selecting areas based on degrees of importance?

http://www.elitetrack.com/plan.pdf

is a pretty good article related to your question.

well i just finally figured out how to post pictures.
i'll look at some video tonight i have at home to double check, but i think this woman uses similar tech to what your girl is using. here's what it looks like midflight.

Quick: Have you found it difficult working the proper arm movement with long limbed athletes?  A stronger emphasis with upper body strength work?
Also notice the immediate emphasis towards "running tall" from Step 7 which is lost in later strides (going to Mike's point).  Though we did a good deal of 20-30-40m work during this period, would 50-60m work help here?

Open question: Are there specific arm actions during the penultimate-takeoff phase that support the proper readiness for a strong stepoff?  Are the strokes short and low, long and high (above the waist), short and high?  Is it more athlete dependent?  Notice the listless and somewhat jumbled arm activity of my athlete in both clips.

Todd: Thanks for the reference to the plan.  A very good read.  I'm going to have to look at some Tatyana Kotova video!  Maybe I can capture some and do a step comparison of that phase.

Price-

Just looking back at this old thread….just curious, is this athlete of yours currently a junior?  Have you been able to see some improvements in the off-season?

Originally posted by jumpscoachmike
Price-

Just looking back at this old thread….just curious, is this athlete of yours currently a junior?  Have you been able to see some improvements in the off-season?

Yes ...:bounce:and no.  The major improvements from our work this fall are sprint speed and takeoff-flight mechanics.  Howver, from the 2 meets already studied, she doesn't complete the runup and remains tentative prior to takeoff.

In her 2nd meet, she jumped 17'2.5" with virtually no vertical component.  A horizontal bound at best!  We discuss this and view video (concerning lowering CM during penult-takeoff transition), however without adequate facilties and/or safe equipment, we attempt to get in as much work during meets as possible.

Though very young, she is a senior, with as I believe, very good talent.  Emotional stress (unrelated to this) has been an issue of late.  We gave her the whole vacation off to better balance those issues.

Any suggestions concerning the technical points mentioned would be welcomed.  I would submit some vidclips for review, however the quality of such may prevent a detailed view.