Elitetrack: Sport Training & Conditioning

Sounds consistant. Standard Euro belief that their way is better because their results come from a start with less talent.  See Bosch’s self-deprication leading into his comments, for an example

Could have a racial undertone if one were to think about it as well…

Detail on Stanley’s opposing views would be interesting.

Dick’s methodology has been evolving.  He “beat up” a bunch of his folks in route to those who had success.  Is said to be addressing this past history on the recruiting trail which sounds like others are negative campagining him out on the trail.

As for L2 “GEDs”.  Its also a touchy subject, internal USATF politics-wise.

Mike Young - 25 July 2008 07:35 AM

tkaberna - 23 July 2008 12:21 PM

I really wish the instructors would rip us when we do the projects though.  I felt as if many of the people did not follow what the instructors had taught and went with what they always do in practice.  I understand that only looking at a specific week as well as a generalized annual plan is hard on the instructors but if you see they are not following the curriculum, I would understand and appreciate a little scolding.  I believe you learn better under pressure like that.

Your project was pretty good so there wasn’t much to tear in to but this is something we need to look at because there was one group in particular that just didn’t seem to get it. The problem is so many people take it really personal. While the educator / coach part of me says ‘who cares?‘, the realistic side of it is that-

1) It creates a lot of problems for the management of the school

2) Some instructors don’t like to be perceived as ‘mean’

3) It’s the end of a very long week, and the time when most instructors are mentally drained

Overall, I think the 8-10 hour a day week long immersion creates a lot of learning and education problems but the entire executive committee is struggling to come up with alternative solutions that don’t create bigger problems along the way.

If I were to make one recommendation, it would be to allocate more time to the training set up presentation. I felt like that was the meat and potatoes and I was overwhelmed initially by the density.

I wouldnt mind to do it individually and have 10 minute time slots to meet with the instructor so you can really see if you know what you are doing.  Going through two of these level II schools now I see one or two individuals taking the reigns and the rest of the group not being able to sound off.  If it were individual then you can really see if the people get the point and you would get each persons perspective vs. one or two individuals in each group. 
I also believe more time needs to be allocated to the training set up.  Since I was in level II jumps and worked with Mike I understood everything he was saying but I know some others were thrown a lot of tools without knowing how to put them all together correctly. 
I would rather a mean instructor I learned from then the nice one that let you think you were on the right path. 
In response to number three up there, you mean when you were closing your eyes and nodding your head when they were presenting you werent closing your eyes to visualize what they were saying?  You had me fooled. 

Chad Williams - 25 July 2008 02:32 PM

If I were to make one recommendation, it would be to allocate more time to the training set up presentation. I felt like that was the meat and potatoes and I was overwhelmed initially by the density.

How long did the jumps group take for the session and who taught it? The reason I ask is that I taught the planning training section for sprints and it was a marathon 5 hour session. I could have kept going but by that time you’re getting outside the curriculum more than we’re allowed to do.

tkaberna - 25 July 2008 04:28 PM

I wouldnt mind to do it individually and have 10 minute time slots to meet with the instructor so you can really see if you know what you are doing.  Going through two of these level II schools now I see one or two individuals taking the reigns and the rest of the group not being able to sound off.  If it were individual then you can really see if the people get the point and you would get each persons perspective vs. one or two individuals in each group.

Some groups do this and I think that it’s a better idea. I actually brought this up as a change that should be made because as you said the Silverback will always pound their chest and the dullards can always hide out in group situations.  That’s why it makes it REALLY bad when the entire group does poorly. 

I also believe more time needs to be allocated to the training set up.

I’ll pass this along. Unlike with the biomechanics section where I can do whatever I want, I’m pretty much at the whim of the sprint coordinator for time restraints and curriculum boundaries. I think one thing that seemed to be useful to all but the group that ‘didn’t get it’ was the specific training plans that we went through. These weren’t actually in the curriculum but we probably could’ve spent more time on them as they seemed to bring up quite a few questions and good discussion on training plan organization.

I think one thing you and Chad need to consider is that the mere fact that you were at L2 AND are active members of the ET community makes you the minority…coaches who have an absolute passion for learning. I’m sure if you polled many of the students, most wouldn’t want to be in the classroom any longer.

In response to number three up there, you mean when you were closing your eyes and nodding your head when they were presenting you werent closing your eyes to visualize what they were saying?  You had me fooled. 

No comment

I actually got the opposite feeling at least from my group about not spending time in the classroom.  After the first night when Tommy skipped I believe the energy system stuff and let us out two hours early, people in my group had said it was nice to get out early but that they expected to be there until 10pm because that is what the schedule has down and they wanted to see that particular lecture.  It wasn’t even complaining about it so much as to making the comment that it wouldnt be a big deal if they stayed.  If you are going to take that portion out bump something from the next day back to that night and you can fit two more hours into the training setup piece.  Also, I thought the relays section just covered what we learned in level I and could be taken out as well.

Some if not most of what you guys are speaking to is called…L3

However, same issues come up with 3.  Someone will complain about “the presenter wasnt strong enough” etc, etc…

Number of attendees is roughly equally to the disparate view points after a school.

I got reamed after working a L1 for sharing an elite coaches view of President Bush and his shot put technique…

Mike Young - 26 July 2008 06:30 AM

Chad Williams - 25 July 2008 02:32 PM

If I were to make one recommendation, it would be to allocate more time to the training set up presentation. I felt like that was the meat and potatoes and I was overwhelmed initially by the density.

How long did the jumps group take for the session and who taught it? The reason I ask is that I taught the planning training section for sprints and it was a marathon 5 hour session. I could have kept going but by that time you’re getting outside the curriculum more than we’re allowed to do.

Boo taught it. I am unsure of the exact time for the whole section but when he started doing the endo/neuro split and began showing examples, it was probably an hour. I personally felt like that was THE lecture and I was overwhelmed at the time.

If I were to venture a guess, it was most likely 4 hours. Still felt fast if you can believe it.

Mike Young - 26 July 2008 06:39 AM

I think one thing you and Chad need to consider is that the mere fact that you were at L2 AND are active members of the ET community makes you the minority…coaches who have an absolute passion for learning. I’m sure if you polled many of the students, most wouldn’t want to be in the classroom any longer.

Point taken. I loved the whole week and wanted more . . . probably more than the curriculum could cover. I remember being outside on our last day and I said to my friends, “I can’t believe it is over, it went by so fast!“ They thought I was nuts because they were pretty happy to be done.

we spent about 4 hrs on training design. about the same as we spent the last few years.

hi, sorry, i’m in the process of moving out west and havent had much internet…

anyway, so…Well, from what i understand Boo’s stuff is grouped together alot, ie, various CNS stuff (sprints, lifts, jumps) on one day, then different TYPE of training the following day for CNS recovery etc…so in a week its kinda like you have 3-4 “main” training days and the other days are like recovery days but they are all enhancing anohter area (like metabolic training)...

With the UK guys, things are more spread out and much less in volume per day but higher in quality for each session…

For example…

Sat - AM - Technical jumps session (6-8 jumps from 10-16 strides depending on where you are in the season, with one transfer skill in between each jump) (ie, 8 step take off over hurdle for parrellel knee drive and height)

Then in the PM it will be approaches or speed devel (10,20,30,40,50x2)

Sun - AM - Plyometrics (2x10 double foot from high box, then single leg plyos off 30cm boxes (bounds and hops, 5 contacts each leg)

then PM would be lifts (cleans, squats, eccentric quads or hamstrings, depending on day, calfs then jump squats.

Theres an example of their weekend training…each session wont go over an hour and theres good break in between…

Can you please provide a weekly setup for the UK people?  Thanks for your time.

would be LIKE this…

sat and sun like above…

mon - circuits or tempo running

tues - rest

wed - appraoches and med ball in the pm (8 ex, all throws, x10, power development)

thurs - endurance bounding in AM (5 exercises, 5 reps, ie 60m skips, 40m bounds, 40m hops etc) then PM weights again.

Friday - rest

this would be a GP phase…

This was posted in the sprint mechanics thread but suits all those who posted on this thread you have to listen to these interviews (they are very long, arround one hour). Tellez and Boo are interviewed and explain their training philosophies extensively.

http://www.athleticscoaching.ca/default.aspx?pid=11&spid=82&sspid=103
http://www.athleticscoaching.ca/default.aspx?pid=11&spid=82&sspid=116

From Boo´s interview: (Sorry if it is a little bit cryptical, notes taken while hearing)

bompa periodization book
early career: block system (3 week system + 1 rest)
late career: rotational scheme, 1 week tech, etc.  (dind´t get this right)
develop speed, power, elasticity / develop other skills secondarily
trains speed earlier, heavy bounding after
very fast accels, then max v, finally speed endurance (!!) due to motor habilities development (hold positions)
jumpers have to deal with impact, absolut strength helps on that
special strength: not that necessary, jump training is more general
plyos: first low intensity bounding , later depht jumps and bounding for power, peak of intensity just at the beg. of the competitive season
avoids long bounding (not specific), md distance perhaps for rythm in the triple jump
periodization: self developed, simple progression, contrast med ball with more intensive, etc. (usual)
elite athletes: fairly intense to very intense, less developed easy to intense

john moffit hadnt had a competition in six weeks before medalling in athens > high training intensities
jumpers who compete more arent unable to get as much quality training
high intensity, low volume towards competition phase

three week block in competition phase
mon: accel (though), bounds, o lifts + squat
tu: short run jumping + circuit
wed: runway rehearsal (hard) + sprint dev + vertical bounding / depht
th: tech + circuit
fri: like monday
sat: speed endurance

that week that boo said…had the UK coaches like whhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!! they couldnt beleieve so much volume and high intensity…they said this was just rediculus and un-neccesary…