[delldell]

delldell on August 1, 2003 at 11:34 pm #8503

Do you think training for 400M would be training the system used in basketball. Obviously an aerobic base is needed, but basketball mainly depends on anaerobic just as football does. Intervals of play in basketball are longer though, so I don't think just short sprints would be as important as they are for football. After I do GPP, what would be ideal if I have 2 days to run. I was thinking one sprint session and one tempo session. Honestly, I know little about all these different terms though. I know there's acc. dev, max v, intensive temp, special/strength/speed? endurance, etc.

[400stud]

400stud on August 2, 2003 at 12:18 am #21386

My opinion…

basketball is anaerobic. Yeah you go for longer bouts than just sprints, but you constantly get the opportunity to intake air because, unless you are guarding a maniac, you are not going to be moving for 48 minutes. So, in my opinion, Ext. Tempo one day and Int. Tempo the next might serve your purpose. You get strength endurance to be able to keep moving without falling apart, you get aerobic endurance, and you get anaerobic endurance as well.

I am a 400 runner and occasionally play basketball and I can tell you that it is aerobic with little anaerobic factors at all.

[delldell]

delldell on August 2, 2003 at 12:42 am #21387

Sorry, I don't know much about track training methods. Could you give an example of extensive? and intensive tempo sessions?

[400stud]

400stud on August 2, 2003 at 3:57 am #21388

The only difference between extensive and intensive tempo is effort.

Ext. Tempo sessions are run at 65-75% of max effort and reps can range from 100-600m for a 400 sprinter. These are more used as a recovery mechanism, in-season, rather than an actual workout. In fact, they should be used as a recovery mechanism and NOT a workout. In early training phases they are useful in helping strengthen bones, joints, and tendons, and helping to prepare the body for the trianing to come. Rests are kept fairly short, depending on the distance ran, and the volume can get as high as 3000m, but I wouldn't recommend going over 2400m…and that's on a good day.

Int. Tempo sessions ARE a workout. They work both aerobic and anaerobic systems and help the body cope with Lactic Acid accumulation. They are more used in early season as well. The effort on these is the "intermediate" level —- 75-90%. Rests are a little longer (1-5 min), and I wouldn't recommend any reps over 400m. I use 100-400m reps. The volume is lower here…usually no larger than 1600m.

[delldell]

delldell on August 3, 2003 at 12:08 am #21389

So would I include sprints on intensive tempo day? I was thinking about doing flying sprints for 30-40M and in and outs over 90 M.

Mike–what do you think about all of this?

[400stud]

400stud on August 3, 2003 at 2:39 am #21390

Int. Tempo is not sprints in the form as you have. I would use Int. Tempo until after basketball season and then do sprints as you suggested after basketball in preparation for track.

You should focus on basketball first if that is your first priority since it is the first thing to come. If it is not, then you might be able to do more sprint work before the season.

Either way, wait at least 2-3 weeks before sprinting or you will be dying. Trust me, I know.

[Mike Young]

Mike Young on August 3, 2003 at 11:38 am #21391

I think 400stud's suggestions are good and I'd just make one additional suggestion. I'd recommend a day of acceleration development / speed development also. You could set it up on a 3 workout cycle consisting of 1 day of intensive tempo, 1 day of extensive tempo, and 1 day of speed / acceleration development. This would of course mean each week you would be doing two different type workouts than the week before but you'd be hitting everything. For example:

Week 1 day 1: Intensive tempo
Week 1 day 2: Extensive tempo

Week 2 day 1: Speed or Acceleration development
Week 2 day 2: Intensive tempo

Week 3 day 1: Extensive tempo
Week 3 day 2: Speed or Acceleration development

and so on….
At the start of the season you could be doing acceleration work (10-30m) and as the season progresses that day would turn into a speed workout day (flying 30s or ins-and-outs). The one thing you'd have to watch out for with this setup is that you always get at least a day of rest between your intensive tempo and speed sessions.

ELITETRACK Founder

[400stud]

400stud on August 3, 2003 at 12:41 pm #21392

So would you suggest basketball practice for him everyday, and before practice, 2x a week, do a track workout? I think that might work because he gets to work on everything.

When you refer to "the season", are you referring to him training through his B-Ball season, or starting training for track?

[delldell]

delldell on August 3, 2003 at 11:23 pm #21393

Thanks for that info Mike. I'm not competitively running 400M. I'm just interested in that event and wanted to know if it trained a similar energy system (which I think it does).

Yeah, I'm going to be playing everyday except for probably sunday when I'll just relax shooting around or something. Mike knows how my lifting will be, so I was thinking of running on T & Th. I like the set-up alot, but what kind of volume would you recommend. I don't think it'd be as high as a runner's since I'm balling almost every day.

Speed/acc dev–Don't really know how to set this up.
Int Tempo–6×100, 80% and gradually increase distance, but cut sets?
Ext Tempo– 6×300, 70%? eventually increasing to 500M, 4 reps?

[Mike Young]

Mike Young on August 4, 2003 at 11:08 am #21394

[i]Originally posted by delldell[/i]
Speed/acc dev–Don't really know how to set this up.
Int Tempo–6×100, 80% and gradually increase distance, but cut sets?
Ext Tempo– 6×300, 70%? eventually increasing to 500M, 4 reps?

For acceleration development, start off with something like 10 x 10m; then do 4 x 10m, 4 x 20m; and then later in the season do 3 x 10m, 3 x 20m, and 3 x 30m. When you've gone through this cycle you could move on to speed development. For speed development do 3-4 x 90m sprint-float-sprints or 6-8 x flying 30s. If you wanted to, you could even alternate speed development days and acceleration days since you're not really training for track or trying to get a peak.

For intensive tempo, I'd do something more like 5 x 150m @ 85% but there's a lot of room to play around with that.

For extensive tempo, your idea sounds fine.

ELITETRACK Founder

[delldell]

delldell on August 4, 2003 at 8:00 pm #21395

gracias

[delldell]

delldell on August 4, 2003 at 11:32 pm #21396

Oh, one last question. Should I rest for full recovery on the sprints. On tempo, is it like 5 minutes on intensive 3 minutes on extensive?

[400stud]

400stud on August 5, 2003 at 4:20 am #21397

Rests depend on distance run and intensity.

Usually for sprints, the cardinal rule is about 1 min per 10m run. However, this may not apply to longer sprints, but for you this would probably be fine.

Ext. Tempo can range from 30 sec. to however long (like 5 min) depending on the distance run. Give an example and I can give you a good rest period.

Int. Tempo is usually 1-5 min depending on distance and again an ex. would be nice.

[delldell]

delldell on August 5, 2003 at 9:43 am #21398

Ok, examples would be:

Int Tempo 5×150 @ 85%
Ext Tempo 6×300 @70%

For the sprint/acc dev Mike recommended, would I do each thing one week or more? i.e. 10×10

[400stud]

400stud on August 5, 2003 at 10:17 am #21399

For the sprint/acc dev Mike recommended, would I do each thing one week or more? i.e. 10×10

I don't understand. What do you mean?

Your other examples are correct, though.

[delldell]

delldell on August 5, 2003 at 7:51 pm #21400

Like would I do 10x10M for more than one week?

What would be the rest periods for those examples?

[400stud]

400stud on August 5, 2003 at 9:05 pm #21401

You can, but I don't know how you are periodizing.

10x10m is 100m volume. You can up that to 12x10m the next week (120m volume), and more, etc., etc. until you hit an unloading week.

I really don't know what you are doing, so can you post a weekly schedule that you plan on doing with basketball and track workouts both. Thanks.

[delldell]

delldell on August 5, 2003 at 9:09 pm #21402

the previous posts explain all of that

[400stud]

400stud on August 5, 2003 at 9:33 pm #21403

Okay, I read it.

You are running Tues./Thurs and balling everyday?

I would say do acc. dev. on Tues., Int. Tempo Thurs. and mabye do Ext. Tempo Mon./Wed./Fri. This way you get speed work, anaerobic and aerobic work. You work everything.

I would say to just increase everything as you feel you can handle it. You are not competitively running the 400 so you don't have to REALLY train for it.

Do 10x10m on Tues., 5×150 on Thurs. and on the other days you can start off at 1000m of tempo, or even lower if you want. The Ext. Tempo will work your aerobic system and help you out a lot for basketball.

[Mike Young]

Mike Young on August 8, 2003 at 6:00 am #21404

[i]Originally posted by delldell[/i]
Like would I do 10x10M for more than one week?

What would be the rest periods for those examples?

Yes, that was my intention when I wrote it.

ELITETRACK Founder

[delldell]

delldell on August 8, 2003 at 8:39 am #21405

[i]Originally posted by mike[/i]
[quote][i]Originally posted by delldell[/i]
Like would I do 10x10M for more than one week?

What would be the rest periods for those examples?

Yes, that was my intention when I wrote it. [/quote]

Huh? so does that mean do it one week or do it more than once? Also, what would be the rest periods for int and ext tempo? I'm guessing full recovery for each sprint?

[Mike Young]

Mike Young on August 8, 2003 at 8:45 am #21406

Do the 10 x 10m for a couple weeks and then switch to longer repeats for your acceleration development work. As for the intensive tempo, rest about 4 minutes and for extensive tempo rest somewhere in the neighborhood of 1 minute. 400stud's previous suggestions for rest
were very good.

ELITETRACK Founder