[flow]

flow on August 23, 2006 at 8:59 pm #12134

hey,  what kind of sprint specific work is indicated in early gpp (with strength focus -lots of squatting and oly lifting)
in an overall short to long progression aiming to the 60m events.

after a hammy injury im not sure if im completely recovered to sprint all out.
so i was thinking of  doing lots of weights, plyos and jumps for a month plus really easy short runs
and then start to gradually implement acc. training (all out sprinting,  resisted runs) asap after that month

general question:  should i do tempo runs or bb cirquits on active recovery days?  i guess tempo is unnecessary regarding the 60m event as  goal ?

btw i wanted to do a 12 week gpp cause im really weak…

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 23, 2006 at 9:52 pm #56204

hey,  what kind of sprint specific work is indicated in early gpp (with strength focus -lots of squatting and oly lifting)
in an overall short to long progression aiming to the 60m events.

after a hammy injury im not sure if im completely recovered to sprint all out.
so i was thinking of  doing lots of weights, plyos and jumps for a month plus really easy short runs
and then start to gradually implement acc. training (all out sprinting,  resisted runs) asap after that month

general question:  should i do tempo runs or bb cirquits on active recovery days?  i guess tempo is unnecessary regarding the 60m event as  goal ?

btw i wanted to do a 12 week gpp cause im really weak…

well like cf said nothing should be really fast or hard anyways.  if you cant run i would continue to lift really heavy, jumps, med throws and maybe heavy sled pulls forward/backward. if i was you i probably would do tempo and bb circuits just so you can be fit, i perfer tempo just bc they are easier to do vs doing so many other little components (jump circuits, med circuits, bb circuits etc). if u do tempo just keep your volume low 1000-1500m and most runs btw 80-150 (mostly100's). to answer ur question u should really try and do something on ur recovery days, you have lots to choose from. below is how i would setup my lifting on a 4 days per week and 3 days per week really focusing on the fsq and bsq.

mon: jumps/med throws 60-80x
power clean
heavy clean pull
back squats
front squats
glut ham/stiff dead

tue:
speed hang snatch
upper work

thur: jump/med throws
power snatch
heavy snacth pulls
fsq
bsq
rev hypers

fri:
hang cleans
upper work

or

mon: jumps and throws
pc
cp
bsq
gh/stiffdead
upper work

wed: jumps
hang clean
snatch deadlifts
walking lunges (optional)
rev hypers
upper work

fri: jumps/throws
ps
sp
fsq
glutham/rdl
upper work

and if you really want to push you could try what i did last year and do the mwf plan but do bsq an fsq on m-f and lunges on wed, you can really get nasty with the weights since your not running.

[flow]

flow on August 25, 2006 at 5:18 am #56205

holy sh… i love that stuff!  especially your last proposal.  should i do the bsq/fsq (both on one day right?)  on friday with less weight or same?
and do walking lunges or normal lunges on weds?
i wanna get right at it AAHRG.
lots of nice ideas in your post:  heavy backward sledpulls (what weight are we talking?  would i run or would it be REALLY heavy?)

would you split the upper work in pecs/back/shoulders or do all of em every day

really awsome cause i have vecations and all ill do is workout,  eat & drink lots and  sleep throughout september.

holy mother of god this will be awsome,  i really missed all out heavy iron work.

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 25, 2006 at 5:58 am #56206

holy sh… i love that stuff!  especially your last proposal.  should i do the bsq/fsq (both on one day right?)  on friday with less weight or same?
and do walking lunges or normal lunges on weds?
i wanna get right at it AAHRG.
lots of nice ideas in your post:  heavy backward sledpulls (what weight are we talking?  would i run or would it be REALLY heavy?)

would you split the upper work in pecs/back/shoulders or do all of em every day

really awsome cause i have vecations and all ill do is workout,  eat & drink lots and  sleep throughout september.

holy mother of god this will be awsome,  i really missed all out heavy iron work.

on wed you could have a 3 week cycle of bar lunges/stepups/spilt squats. if u do the 3 day spilt you could probably do a heavy bench and row movement, then on wed do pullups and bic and tri, and fri some type of speed movement for upper body (speed bp/reb pushups etc), shoulder and tri.  all upper work keep it 3-4×6-12 besides ur heavy bp you can use a 5-3-1 wave load and speed day is pretty simple.  sled pulls put as much weight as possible 200-400lb and walk forward working on acc position/and backwards. 

[flow]

flow on August 25, 2006 at 6:32 am #56207

nice : )
and should i c the oly lifts as auxiliry work and do them as kind of a warm up,  or should i emphasize them too?
im thinking of sth like 3*4 ?

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 25, 2006 at 6:36 am #56208

nice : )
and should i c the oly lifts as auxiliry work and do them as kind of a warm up,  or should i emphasize them too?
im thinking of sth like 3*4 ?

hell no, ol are just as key, focus on them.

[flow]

flow on August 25, 2006 at 7:45 am #56209

so what rep/set scheme is cool 4 them?

[Carson Boddicker]

Carson Boddicker on August 25, 2006 at 8:40 am #56210

I'd go no higher than 3 reps per set of any Oly.    At heavier weights, if you go any higher I've noticed a big breakdown in technique.  Mike Burgener, arguably one of the best Oly coaches in the country, rarely goes above 2 reps per set on classical lifts. 

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 25, 2006 at 10:12 am #56211

I'd go no higher than 3 reps per set of any Oly.    At heavier weights, if you go any higher I've noticed a big breakdown in technique.  Mike Burgener, arguably one of the best Oly coaches in the country, rarely goes above 2 reps per set on classical lifts. 

it depends, u have to remember burgener is working with weightliters. i know many coaches who start beginners out at 5×5 or 5×3 and it work well.

[Kebba Tolbert]

Kebba Tolbert on August 26, 2006 at 10:44 pm #56212

I'd go no higher than 3 reps per set of any Oly.    At heavier weights, if you go any higher I've noticed a big breakdown in technique.  Mike Burgener, arguably one of the best Oly coaches in the country, rarely goes above 2 reps per set on classical lifts. 

We do sets of 6 in the early prep phases, but one we get serious we almost never do more than 3 reps. the early fall reps will be some variation of a pull combo, e.g., pull to waist x2, full pull x2, clean x2.

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 26, 2006 at 10:53 pm #56213

[quote author="wsgeneral" date="1156475475"]
I'd go no higher than 3 reps per set of any Oly.    At heavier weights, if you go any higher I've noticed a big breakdown in technique.  Mike Burgener, arguably one of the best Oly coaches in the country, rarely goes above 2 reps per set on classical lifts. 

We do sets of 6 in the early prep phases, but one we get serious we almost never do more than 3 reps. the early fall reps will be some variation of a pull combo, e.g., pull to waist x2, full pull x2, clean x2.
[/quote]

what is a pull to waist and full, hope u not doing high pull bc they are bad for tech.

[Kebba Tolbert]

Kebba Tolbert on August 26, 2006 at 10:55 pm #56214

yep we do high pulls from the floor.

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 26, 2006 at 10:59 pm #56215

yep we do high pulls from the floor.

why? whats the point.

[Carson Boddicker]

Carson Boddicker on August 26, 2006 at 11:41 pm #56216

High pulls are not really bad for technique.  Obviously once you start pulling with your arms, it better be bringing your body in a downward direction if you are trying to clean or snatch, but pulling up teaches you to keep the bar close.  Coach Burgener uses the high pull as technique work as well as the muscle snatch/clean which is majorly pulling up on the bar. 

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on August 26, 2006 at 11:45 pm #56217

High pulls are not really bad for technique.  Obviously once you start pulling with your arms, it better be bringing your body in a downward direction if you are trying to clean or snatch, but pulling up teaches you to keep the bar close.  Coach Burgener uses the high pull as technique work as well as the muscle snatch/clean which is majorly pulling up on the bar.  

not gonna get into this with u again, it has been proven that high pulls are not good for tech. i think gayle hatch is lil better then burgener. i think sometimes u like to disagree just to disagree. lol

[Carson Boddicker]

Carson Boddicker on September 2, 2006 at 2:09 am #56218

[quote author="wsgeneral" date="1156615934"]
High pulls are not really bad for technique.  Obviously once you start pulling with your arms, it better be bringing your body in a downward direction if you are trying to clean or snatch, but pulling up teaches you to keep the bar close.

not gonna get into this with u again, it has been proven that high pulls are not good for tech. i think gayle hatch is lil better then burgener. i think sometimes u like to disagree just to disagree. lol

ch Burgener uses the high pull as technique work as well as the muscle snatch/clean which is majorly pulling up on the bar. 
[/quote]

No, I disagree because I feel I have a point.  They do teach you to keep the bar over your area of base, a very important factor in Olympic lifting.  You say it has been proven, but why have so many elites been successful when phasing in high pulls at certain times?  What is your proof?  The statement of one man?  That's like saying CF has everything about training a sprinter right, or Arthur Lydiard had every factor in developing a successful distance runner down.  Keep in mind here, you dont know all–I will say that you certainly know your stuff, but you certainly are not correct in every matter. 

[richard-703]

richard-703 on September 2, 2006 at 3:11 am #56219

Hey UTfootball4,
When you say highpulls are bad for technique, do you mean bad for your snatch and cleans techniques?

Or do you think they are bad in general? With my shoulder problems (and inflexibility) I don't really want to get into snatches or cleans anyway. I can get (I think) most of what I would want from cleans just by doing high pulls.

Maybe it depends exactly what you call "highpulls". I explode off the floor, but shut down early, and don't really go above the sternum.

[utfootball4]

utfootball4 on September 2, 2006 at 5:21 am #56220

Hey UTfootball4,
When you say highpulls are bad for technique, do you mean bad for your snatch and cleans techniques?

Or do you think they are bad in general? With my shoulder problems (and inflexibility) I don't really want to get into snatches or cleans anyway. I can get (I think) most of what I would want from cleans just by doing high pulls.

Maybe it depends exactly what you call "highpulls". I explode off the floor, but shut down early, and don't really go above the sternum.

High pulls are bad for your clean/snatch tech. The pulls you are doing are great “regular clean/snatch pulls to your waist”. ELBOWS BEND POWER ENDS.