Would lets say
6x500m, first 300m hurdles,rest run, done at about 75-85% with about 2 min rest in between, be a good extensive tempo 400ih workout?
Should I make the hurdling longer? Like all 500m?
Extensive tempo 400ih workouts
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KeymasterI actually wouldn’t run so long. I think you’d be better off cutting the distance in half and running twice as many. Also, running hurdles at competition spacing at extensive tempo pace isn’t typically done because the speed between hurdles (and therefore the step patterns) is so different than what one would experience in a race.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
if youre going to use hurdles at all, you need to put them at a spacing that will mimic the rhythm of the actual race. you will need to put the hurdles at intervals that will necesitate the same amount of steps as an actual race. 10x 300 is probably too high a volume also, and 80% is too fast. if you wanted you may be able to do rhythm work in place of extensive tempo, but id like to hear others thoughts before i reccomend.
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Keymaster
It seems you are mixing a lot of different variables which typically don’t go well together (medium intensity, hurdles, etc.). What is the purpose of the workout? We’d be able to give better recomendations if we knew.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
Ok, the purpose of extensive tempo is to “enhance the ability to cope with lactate” well im wondering if i could add in hurdles to a extensive tempo workout, so I can enhave my ability to go over the hurdles with lactate.
im not sure if thats a good or not? Maybe i should keep them seperated? but also like i find it really hard to get over the3-4 or so hurdles in 400ih.
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Participant
First, there should be no accumulation of lactate during extensive tempo!
Second, unless you have a high level of ability wouldn’t try incorporate hurdles in to a tempo workout as its addition will probably raise the intensity abovet 70/75%!
Third, if you wish to improve your ability to tolerate lactate in a hurdle race consider doing repeat 200m w/hurdles, do various split runs, ie. run 200m w/o hurdles wait 60s then run say the last 200m with hurdles. I’ve had an athlete run the last 5 hurdles (approx. 150m) starting at rouglhy the 200m mark and then jog back to where they started and repeat. That was used my old coach, it’s pretty tough!
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Keymaster
RandyG,
Great post. I agree with everything you said except I actually do think extensive tempo helps athletes cope with lactate. While there shouldn’t be significant lactate accumulation, one of the overall effects at running at the paces and rest intervals associated with extensive tempo is that lactate tolerance will be enhanced although no where near the enhancement from intensive tempo or special endurance 2.ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
“While there shouldn’t be significant lactate accumulation, one of the overall effects at running at the paces and rest intervals associated with extensive tempo is that lactate tolerance will be enhanced ”
I’m not trying to be difficult, but could you explain this further….I don’t understand why you would want to accumulate lactate during extensive tempo workouts as it is for recovery and possibly the development of aerobic power (IMO). Save the lactate tolerance or capacity for those such workouts and away from extensive workouts.
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Keymaster
RandyG-
*While I’d love to claim it was, what I mentioned previously is not my definition nor my physiological explanation. Most coaching sources that I’m aware of defining extensive tempo (on the net, USATF coaching manuals, etc.) would state that lactate tolerance is one of the training effects of extensive tempo work. While there are some that make no mention of lactate I can’t think of any that say that extensive tempo can not or should not result in a lactic state. Also, from a physiological standpoint, lactate is an inevitable (perhaps not substantial but nonetheless significant) by-product of the paces and rest intervals associated with running an extensive tempo workout. So while you may very well be correct in stating that lactate tolerance would best be developed through other means, it doesn’t mean it isn’t addressed to a lesser extent via extensive tempo. It also doesn’t mean that it won’t aid in recovery as my next point explains.
*Lactic acid is one of the primary triggers for growth hormone release. Meaning that despite the commonly held belief that it is devil-spawn, it can actually be a catalyst for a beneficial hormonal profile.
*In addition to the above point, low intensity exercise may help to strengthen soft tissue and increase overall blood flow. The latter may actually help in the removal of excess lactate.ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
[i]Originally posted by mike[/i]
RandyG-
*While I’d love to claim it was, what I mentioned previously is not my definition nor my physiological explanation. Most coaching sources that I’m aware of defining extensive tempo (on the net, USATF coaching manuals, etc.) would state that lactate tolerance is one of the training effects of extensive tempo work. While there are some that make no mention of lactate I can’t think of any that say that extensive tempo can not or should not result in a lactic state. Also, from a physiological standpoint, lactate is an inevitable (perhaps not substantial but nonetheless significant) by-product of the paces and rest intervals associated with running an extensive tempo workout. So while you may very well be correct in stating that lactate tolerance would best be developed through other means, it doesn’t mean it isn’t addressed to a lesser extent via extensive tempo. It also doesn’t mean that it won’t aid in recovery as my next point explains.
*Lactic acid is one of the primary triggers for growth hormone release. Meaning that despite the commonly held belief that it is devil-spawn, it can actually be a catalyst for a beneficial hormonal profile.
*In addition to the above point, low intensity exercise may help to strengthen soft tissue and increase overall blood flow. The latter may actually help in the removal of excess lactate.To better help me understand you point(s), what percentages are these “extensive tempo” workouts executed at?
Thanks
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Keymaster
Extensive tempo is typically defined as being work done at 60-80% of maximum heart rate or 65-85% of maximal effort….again this is a general definition from several sources and not my opinion. USATF coaches education defines it as 70-80% effort.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
[i]Originally posted by mike[/i]
Extensive tempo is typically defined as being work done at 60-80% of maximum heart rate or 65-85% of maximal effort….again this is a general definition from several sources and not my opinion. USATF coaches education defines it as 70-80% effort.The average intensity is 75%! That is so slow that lactate development would take many runs with short recovery and more importantly you would be running at rythym far slower than that of competition that it may cause problem with stride patterns. I feel that if your going to develop lactate tolerance, particularly in the hurdles, then it should be at pace reflecting that of competition and at similar stride pattern. 75% is just too slow to me for it to be effective/applicable. Again save extensive tempo for flat running and aerobic power development unless you are a elite performer where the inclusion of hurdles in extensive tempo workouts can be kept at a low intensity…..again just my opinion.:roll:
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Keymaster
I agree with everything you said. I wasn’t disagreeing with your points about what extensive tempo would best be used for or how it should be used, I was just saying that their is no denying that lactate tolerance is one of (although not the primary) training effects of extensive tempo. I actually wouldn’t suggest using hurdles during extensive tempo work for athletes of any level.
ELITETRACK Founder
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