[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 11, 2011 at 1:35 am #17536

I have a female 400 runner who is a great kid and quite talented. She is very strong and able to complete all work outs. Her PR is 64.2 but I believe she is capable of much faster times based off her work in practice and commitment level.

What I think is holding her back is her head. We talk race strategy and she gets it…too much. She tells me she gets in the race and focuses too much on what to do at each section of the race rather than letting her body take over. This leads her to getting in her own way and it effects her performance. The same is true in the pole vault with her.

Do you guys have any suggestions for helping get her out of this funk?

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 12, 2011 at 4:09 am #107926

Hi ud19.
I don’t mean to be overly simplistic when I say that maybe you shouldn’t talk to her about race strategy. She probably needs to just relax and run as fast as she can. It will take a few races without a strategy to ‘feel’ it but that would be my starting point. How old is she? I have a similar problem with a 14yo 300m runner who over thinks things. She has a 61.5 400m time and my strategy is to spend time taking her mind off the race.

[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 12, 2011 at 11:41 am #107935

We actually haven’t talked strategy since the second week of practice, a month and a half ago. She’s 16-17 years old and an honor student. She takes things very much to heart and wants to do everything the coach says.

She had a small breakthrough today running 65.1. Hopefully more to come.

[bman]

bman on May 12, 2011 at 12:25 pm #107937

Yea, I know what you mean exactly. I’ll be interested to hear any advice people have on this.

[Christopher Glaeser]

Christopher Glaeser on May 14, 2011 at 4:32 pm #107986

– What is her 30 meter fly?

– What is her PR in the 200?

– What is her 200 meter split when running the 400?

Best,
Christopher

[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 18, 2011 at 10:33 pm #108133

I don’t know her 30m fly off the top of my head.

200 PR= 27.7
200 split is around 30.x

[Christopher Glaeser]

Christopher Glaeser on May 19, 2011 at 4:55 am #108141

I don’t know her 30m fly off the top of my head.

Do you know her maximum velocity at any short distance?

Best,
Christopher

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 19, 2011 at 10:36 pm #108156

One way to do it would be to use a time predictor. They’re a bit subjective due to all the other factors, but a good psychological tool. Does she have a recent 60m time or 100m time. If so, go to BrainMac website and hunt down the 400m predictions on there. If she knows she can do a better time, then it might clear the mental block. However, be careful that it doesn’t create more anxiety that she’s under-performing. You’ll have to call that one based on your knowledge of her.
Another way of doing it is to put her in a race of someone faster and use them to pace her, so she doesn’t have to think about it too much. I’ve used this with a talented Under 15 400m runner who I entered into a graded open meet against 7 Under 20 sprinters. He came second.

[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 19, 2011 at 10:46 pm #108157

We did a workout yesterday that gave us a pretty good idea of what she’s capable of doing. Times gave us a time of around 63.x. I tried to spin it as a positive.

[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 19, 2011 at 10:47 pm #108158

– What is her 30 meter fly?

– What is her PR in the 200?

– What is her 200 meter split when running the 400?

Best,
Christopher

The only max V time I have for her is an improperly timed fly 30. It was a fly 30 with a 20m run in. I timed the whole run, not just the 30m zone. Her 50m time was consistently in the 7.6-7.8 range.

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 21, 2011 at 12:14 am #108180

We did a workout yesterday that gave us a pretty good idea of what she’s capable of doing. Times gave us a time of around 63.x. I tried to spin it as a positive.

What was the workout that gave that result? Have you got any recent competition times that are shorter than 400m?

[underdog_19]

underdog_19 on May 21, 2011 at 1:06 am #108181

2×160/160/160 (stopping time at 80m for last 160)

Each set when adding the times together gave the 63.x range.

She’s run 100 in 13.3, the 200 in 26.6 and her only other 200 was a really poor time the morning after prom.

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 21, 2011 at 1:36 am #108182

From what I can see the 160 set didn’t tell you much. I don’t think training times are a good indicator for race times personally even in testing.

I’ve put the 26.6 200m time into Brian Mac’s sprtin predictor calculator and this predicts a 60.85 for the 400m. I have used this predictor a few times and it is pretty good. Obviously it is dependent on the right training but it shouldn’t be far out and good enough to give her a kick. She’s obviously got sufficient speed.

Lee

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 21, 2011 at 1:38 am #108183

I should have added that the algorithms used on the Brian Mac website are credited to Frank Dick so they’ve got pedigree.

[W.E. Price]

W.E. Price on May 21, 2011 at 2:24 am #108185

What I’ve found to work with my athletes (running the 400) is to run a relatively similar segment of the race in competition warmup that was put in place and executed correctly in practice. Typically early in comps an athlete would do perhaps a 150 or 250 that would be the target opening in the race. Later in the season, as density might rise with decreasing total volume, A shorter opening would be coupled with larger finishing work.

Of course relaxation and moderate emphasis on max sprinting seemed to work for them as well. Recently one female Qmiler went 63.4 (37h/250) to 61.2 (21h/150) within the same training block. However, with a few exceptions, I haven’t worked with many female youth Qmilers so a sample here may not rate significantly.

[W.E. Price]

W.E. Price on May 21, 2011 at 3:18 am #108189

…In my experience, the 300m is a much better predictor of 400m performance because over the years I have seen that most good HS 400m girls where I live run between 15 and 16 seconds for the last 100m no matter their subjective ability. Have to have them attack that 2nd curve so that they try to keep their speed up through 300m.

Agree with regard to the 300. The threshold marker seems key in most cases. Though specific work can be tailored for individual and predisposed distinct qualities.

[Lee Ness]

Lee Ness on May 23, 2011 at 10:38 pm #108228

I’d agree with the 300m being a better prdictor but for two things.
1. We weren’t give a 300m time to enable a prediction from it, and
2. The original post was the paralysis by analysis where the girl in question was over-thinking the race. My intent with the time predictor was to try and loosen her up and run the race by letting her knows what she’s capable of.
As I said at the time, I think care needs to be taken that it doesn’t do the opposite and increases performance pressure.

[Christopher Glaeser]

Christopher Glaeser on May 24, 2011 at 2:59 am #108230

The only max V time I have for her is an improperly timed fly 30. It was a fly 30 with a 20m run in.

If space and other factors permit, you should consider adding maximum velocity measurements to your program and maintain a log so you can monitor progress. The 30 (or 34) meter fly are long enough to hand time with reasonable accuracy and short enough to be near maxV. Adding an occasional test at the long end, such as the 300, will provide good predictors for all the sprints, including the 400.

Best,
Christopher