I don't do a ton of heavy squatting during the season because it just drains me so much. But, I do pistol (one-legged) squats, and can do 9-10 reps at a bodyweight of 190 lbs, or 86.4 kg. It's not exactly throwing around 600 lbs like a champion lifter, but I was wondering if this is a decent amount of relative strength, seeing as how I've never been a big squatter anyway.
Pistol Squats, Relative Strength
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KeymasterYou can get a loose estimation and comparison of pistol squats to barbell squats by adding your bodyweight to the external barbell load for barbell squats and then dividing by three to see the load on each leg (in practice, three seems to be more appropriate than the seemingly logical 2 due to the fact that you have to discount the working leg and take in to take in to account diminished balance of unilateral exercises). You then compare that to half your bodyweight (+ any external load) for pistol squats.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Member
Mike, in the Inno-Sport system there is something called appropriated weight. It would work like this:
Athlete A weighs 200 lbs
He has a max squat of 400 lbsA squat involves lifting approximately 85% of the body in addition to the external load.
A single leg squat also involves lifting around 85% of one's BW
(.85 x 200=170 lbs) + 400 lbs = 570 lbs total lifted in a Maximal squat.
570/2=285 lbs per leg of loading
285 – 170 lbs = 125 lbsSo, if athlete A can do a pistol with 125 lbs of extra loading then he is getting the same amount of loading on his legs as a 400 lb squat.
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Participant
Appropriating weight- Another important thing to note is that when figuring load you need to factor your bodyweight into the load. For example, you???re doing bench presses and they call for you to use 50% of your 1rm. Say your 1rm is 100 lbs and you weigh 100 lbs. First you need to determine how much of your bodyweight is involved in the movement. Here is a chart that will help
Bench press- 15%
Squat – 85%
Deadlift- 40-55%
Military Press- 15%
Reverse Hyper- 40-60%
HF Abs- 47%
Manual G/Ham- 90%
Machine G/Ham- 65%
Biceps/Triceps- 6%from inno sports
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Keymaster
195lbs+550lbs = 745/3= 248
1/2 bw= 97lbs
what does this tell me again?
It says if your back squat max is 550 (+ bw) then you pistol squats with no external loading won't provide much of an equivalent training stimulus.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Keymaster
Mike, in the Inno-Sport system there is something called appropriated weight. It would work like this:
Athlete A weighs 200 lbs
He has a max squat of 400 lbsA squat involves lifting approximately 85% of the body in addition to the external load.
A single leg squat also involves lifting around 85% of one's BW
(.85 x 200=170 lbs) + 400 lbs = 570 lbs total lifted in a Maximal squat.
570/2=285 lbs per leg of loading
285 – 170 lbs = 125 lbsSo, if athlete A can do a pistol with 125 lbs of extra loading then he is getting the same amount of loading on his legs as a 400 lb squat.
Yeah. I've seen that equation before but in practice it's never quite worked for my athletes. It always predicts the single leg equivalent too high. I know plenty of people that can back squat 400 lbs for a single but I've never seen anyone who could pistol squat more than 100 lbs. Granted, this could be a specificity of training effect but I suspect that it is more due to the effect that reduced balance and stability has on the display of maximal strength.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Member
Mike, I find it quite the opposite. My legs are able to handle a much higher load individually than I ever could in the back squat. Here is a link to me doing reactive single leg squats with 70 lbs of extra resistance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K3aJy-5ppM
They're not quite pistols, but they're pretty dang close. I can get 5-6 normal reps with BW + 90 lbs.
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Keymaster
What's your back squat max and bw?
Also, the discrepancy may be in the methods…pistol squats are quite a bit harder because the extended leg effectively makes for a heavier leg (due to increased moment arm). This could throw off my calculation. If the leg were just dropped down as in your video then perhaps the equation might be closer for my athletes. Also, having the external loading both in front and behind (as in your video) would make the exercise slightly easier because the weights would counterbalance slightly.
ELITETRACK Founder
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Member
What's your back squat max and bw?
Also, the discrepancy may be in the methods…pistol squats are quite a bit harder because the extended leg effectively makes for a heavier leg (due to increased moment arm). This could throw off my calculation. If the leg were just dropped down as in your video then perhaps the equation might be closer for my athletes. Also, having the external loading both in front and behind (as in your video) would make the exercise slightly easier because the weights would counterbalance slightly.
I currently weigh between 195-198 lbs @ just under 6'1". I haven't back squatted in a long time, but I have ATG front squatted 285 x 4 recently.
And I agree. I set my SL squats up so that I would be able to use a higher load, but still keep it light enough so as to keep my spinal loading minimal. I've only done them twice, but balance really doesn't seem to be an issue. I like them much more than any form of barbell squat. They hit the glutes and adductors much harder.
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Participant
Although somewhat impressive RJ, your video imitates more of a step up than a pistol squat. I would think that most athletes can perform the step up with much more weight than in a pistol. The difference of two exercises being where your COM is located over your support foot. This changes the degree of the muscles used between the two exercises. Also, as Mike said, the balance, coordination and postural integrity needed to successfully do a pistol makes it much more difficult, especially with external weight.
For instance, I'm coaching an athlete who can do a step-up with 225 lbs at a bodyweight of 235 lbs. This same athlete has trouble holding onto a 25 lb. plate while doing pistols.
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Participant
Although somewhat impressive RJ, your video imitates more of a step up than a pistol squat. I would think that most athletes can perform the step up with much more weight than in a pistol. The difference of two exercises being where your COM is located over your support foot. This changes the degree of the muscles used between the two exercises. Also, as Mike said, the balance, coordination and postural integrity needed to successfully do a pistol makes it much more difficult, especially with external weight.
For instance, I'm coaching an athlete who can do a step-up with 225 lbs at a bodyweight of 235 lbs. This same athlete has trouble holding onto a 25 lb. plate while doing pistols.
i agree, i squat 550, lunge 315+, 1 leg squat 275+ an probably cant do one pistol squat (i never done them before).
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Keymaster
As I said I've never had an athlete do pistols with more than 100 lbs. My point wasn't necessarily to correlate the two lifts but to show that those equations are really just loose guidelines and that the inno-sport %s are too high. When you start getting in to specific numbers or not taking in to account the affects of diminished balance they don't really work. The equations also tend to point out the fact that you can't really work maximal strength development in single support.
UT-
I'm sure you could pistol squat more if you practiced it however it likely wouldn't be any where near what the equation would suggest. The inno-sport equations tend to predict out too high.ELITETRACK Founder
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Participant
As I said I've never had an athlete do pistols with more than 100 lbs. My point wasn't necessarily to correlate the two lifts but to show that those equations are really just loose guidelines and that the inno-sport %s are too high. When you start getting in to specific numbers or not taking in to account the affects of diminished balance they don't really work. The equations also tend to point out the fact that you can't really work maximal strength development in single support.
UT-
I'm sure you could pistol squat more if you practiced it however it likely wouldn't be any where near what the equation would suggest. The inno-sport equations tend to predict out too high.please dont mention inno sport-lol.
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Member
My back squat pr is 315 ATG with the bar at mid-trap. I don't squat much during the season to prevent fatigue. I just did split squats with 185 last week for 4 reps at a weight of 190 lbs, but I feel that my back is more a limiting factor than leg strength. I know that it just means that I need to improve torso strength, but I'm just wondering if my strength is appropriate for higher-intensity plyos,
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Participant
My back squat pr is 315 ATG with the bar at mid-trap. I don't squat much during the season to prevent fatigue. I just did split squats with 185 last week for 4 reps at a weight of 190 lbs, but I feel that my back is more a limiting factor than leg strength. I know that it just means that I need to improve torso strength, but I'm just wondering if my strength is appropriate for higher-intensity plyos,
most people would say yes bc they recommend 1.5 bw, but i think you could improve strength alittle more. i think you should be able to spilt squat more then 185×4.
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Keymaster
I think you can handle some higher intensity plyos. Watch for excessively long ground contacts and double-hops…these are sure signs you aren't ready.
ELITETRACK Founder
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