Does anyone have information regarding testing average bench marks for track athletes? i.e. 1RM bench & squat, verticle jump, local muscular endurance, etc.:dance:
testing standards
-
-
Participant
-
KeymasterWe'd have to know what event group, age, gender, etc. to give anything worth while.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
How about for male high school sprinters. 200 & 400 events. Beyond that, are there any periodicals or manuals that include all sports possibly?
-
Participant
What about for a 14-16 year old female sprinter?
-
Keymaster
If you look through some European literature (especially Russian) you'll find tons of testing standards for all age and event groups. I'm currently away from the office and don't have access to my books but will give a look when I get back.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
[i]Originally posted by mike[/i]
If you look through some European literature (especially Russian) you'll find tons of testing standards for all age and event groups. I'm currently away from the office and don't have access to my books but will give a look when I get back.Thanks mike, will be anxiously awaiting this info.
-
Participant
you havent forgot about this thread have you mike?:tumble:
-
Keymaster
Me, forget……never. I'm about as absent minded as it gets some times. I'm actually at hom now but will check either tomorrow or Monday. For starters though, you can check out
this article[/b] which has some testing numbers for sprinters.ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
interesting article mike. cant wait for you to get more marks for our lazy butts:wink:. could someone explain to me what was meant by reach in table two?
-
Keymaster
Here are some selected results for testing protocols:
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
thats interesting mike, im adding new goals every second:wink:. could someone tell me what the reach was that i mentioned in my other post?
-
Participant
That is an awesome table! I need to print that off for my high school kids. That's really cool. I wish I could have had that when I was younger.
-
Keymaster
Those numbers aren't definitive as I've got several other charts with different (but similar) numbers for the very same tests. Of all the numbers though, I think the strengh numbers are the least important indicators. While I certainly don't want to devalue those numbers I've seen tons of kids run very fast without having great strength levels (at least as defined by those tests). Having said that though, I do think strength is one of the easiest traits to develop and can make a big difference for those individuals who are lacking in other areas (elasticity, RFD, mechanics, etc.).
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
yeah, my 11.6 was run when i squatted roughly 205 so i think everyone know these arent set in stone. but they are slight indicators to what an athlete could do, if taken together, right?
-
Participant
Mike – Can you tell me what publication you got this from? I'd like to read more.
-
Keymaster
Those particular numbers were from some unpublished material I got from Remi Korchemny. I'm pretty sure I also have some similar data from New Studies in Athletics as well as Soviet Sports Review.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Keymaster
Delldell-
I don’t have it right now. I think all attachments must have been deleted in the process of upgrading the messageboard last week. I actually made the table just for this thread and never saved it afterwards….. 😯 I have quite a few tables and I’m not even exactly sure which I used (I know it was by Korchemni but it was a highly abbreviated version of one of his much larger charts). Is there anything in particular you were interested in?ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
bump..
testing standards anyone? -
Participant
It may be junk, but check the BSF website for their averages for boy and girl performance levels. I offer no assurances for the stats but if nothing its a start.
True benchmarking comes from keeping years of testing your own kids and cross referencing the end of year times and distances against the testing.
Which brings up the most important point I have to offer. Testing an individual establishes a level of strength, conditioning, test performance (meet performance is the most obvious example of testing)
Retesting (assuming the tests have been learned so that improvement comes from strength and conditioning gains and not just getting better at the test) will show the benefit and or lack there of, from the proceeding training. So having national averages is always second to tracking the individual against themselves.
Take for example measuring VJ. How many different ways do people adulterate the true VJ just to get a slight advantage? And now you are going to compare kids from all over? On another webchat, someone offered “cheats” to test out better. What does that prove? (no offense to my little dynamo fellow board member) Here’s a question:
Get any two athletes or two coaches to agree on what constitutes a “Flying 30″…Conditions need to remain constant to provide worthwhile data. The latter being huge when we are talking inches, tenths of seconds, etc.
-
Participant
Good points.
Just curious what numbers do you see in slj vert. 5 bound tests of the athletes you have coach and your BEST athletes? -
Participant
Q
In 24 years I have only had two kids like you.
In the late 80’s I had a rural HS kid that was 5′ 7″ 155lbs go
22’3″ 44’9″ 6′ 5″ and 185′ jav
11 years ago I had a city kid at the college (your build) go from 19′ to 22′ 7″ in 2 years.Neither kid was being regularly tested.
Currently I have some ok guys 30″ VJ or so. But I dont test like most do. Because I dont normally work with sprinters, my testing is somewhat different. I test: Static Vertical, CMJ and 24″ drop jump height, and OHB’s
Once in a while a flying 30 (though its somewhat random as to how people run the fly portion) And once in a while some bounding.
But the 30 isnt important as most of the LJ TJ kids run the indoor 60 which is a more accurate and consistant measure (being FAT even though “over distance” for a runway kid) And like I said in the earlier post, event performance, the testing above, and weightroom results, tell me a hell of a lot more than say more random variable stuff like 5 bounds or a flying 30 will, along with being more accurate.
Best athlete I have right now is the Mrs.
2.5m SLJ 15m+ in OHB with a 4k ball, 24′ true VJ, and can dunk!!! Man I am starting to think this may be her year??? -
Keymaster
Dave-
My wife can beat yours……nah nah nah nah nah naaah30m: 4.36 FAT
SLJ: 2.67 into sand; 2.60 onto mat
VJ: 0.73 (~29″)
5 Hop: 12.96m
Squat: 110 kg (242 lb)
Clean: 80 kg (176 lb)
Pullups: 19
Pullups w/ 50 lbs of chains over shoulders: 6
OHB: 13.7mAll at a shade under 5 feet tall and 110 lbs….she’s a beast.
I’ll post more test results later.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
Why yes she can, just keep in mind that your offspring better not have thinning hair on top…cause our kids will be able to call them on it!!! Having observed your superior intellect I am sure that with the addition of the New Orleans phone book to their seat, the future little Youngs will terrorize the chess club!!!
For my part, I am already stocking up on 2 sets of bumper stickers
a. “My kid can beat up your honor student”
b. “If God had not meant for man to eat animals, why did he make them out of meat”As for testing, you prove my point. Testing and comparison is particular to the individuals morphology, environment (bet Mrs. Y’s OHB would be allot better if she spent a winter shoveling the driveway) training environment, performance areas and goals for, etc, etc…
The use/value of testing results from others as some sort of measuring stick has some value but is far from a magic bullet.
More like Jack’s magic beans… Speaking of beans, what the hell are you feeding her? and remember before you are mean to her, she knows where you sleep!!!As for Mrs. K, a 300+ 1RM 1/2 Squat with the disadvantage of a 36″ inseam, doesnt suck.
Actually, “the Portland Yoda’s” wife might give “Mighty Jo Young” a run for her money, with “Mrs Toddler” winning in the duration of effort catagory? Got no background on “the woman who wears the pants” in Miami, and the lack of an XX partner in the Central Mass and NorthEast Florida branches leaves me nothing to work with there.
-
Keymaster
I haven’t forgotten about this thread but I’ll be away from my office for the next couple days. I’ll post some test results when I get back. Also, we hold our big testing session in 2 weeks and I’ll post the highlights.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Keymaster
Here are a couple results from some notable names:
30m: (timed with a touchpad and timing gait)
Kelly Willie 3.72
Donovan Bailey 3.75 (I wasn’t at LSU when he ran this one but it’s the post-grad 30m record)
Walter Davis 3.79
John Moffitt 3.83
Lolo Jones 4.08
Muna Lee 4.14SLJ:
Walter Davis 3.68m (probably a WR)
Lejuan Simon 3.45m
Tina Harris 3.02mSTJ:
Walter Davis 10.79m
Tina Harris 8.55m
Lolo Jones 8.41mOHB:
Chris Hercules 18.58m
Claston Bernard 18.49m
Lejuan Simon 18.20mBLF:
Claston Bernard 17.50m
Walter Davis: 17.01mAlso, we never test on 5-hop but we had a guy 3 years ago who I’m sure could have gone 17m+.
We have our big test “meet” next week. I’ll post some results afterward.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
holy crap is right, lolo jones is soo hot.
:tumble:
-
Participant
:bounce:
-
Keymaster
[i]Originally posted by 800prince[/i]
bumpWas the bump for anything specific? I looked for an unanswered question but couldn’t find one. We have out test competition tomorrow evening so I’ll post some highlight results tomorrow night.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Keymaster
Some highlights from Tuesday’s Pentathlon:
Tina Harris (sophomore All-American jumper): 303 points
-
[*]STJ: 8.43m
[*]SLJ: 2.97m
[*]30m FAT: 4.20
[*]BLF: 15.12m
[*]OHB: 15.85mMuna Lee (post-grad sprinter / Olympian):
-
[*]30m FAT: 4.07
Walter Davis (post-grad jumper / Olympian): 423 points…..off of only 3 weeks of training
-
[*]STJ: 10.40m
[*]SLJ: 3.42m
[*]30m FAT: 3.76
[*]BLF: 17.48m
[*]OHB: 18.08mKwami Roberts (Junior Multi): 384 points
-
[*]STJ: 9.81m
[*]SLJ: 3.27m
[*]30m FAT: 3.93
[*]BLF: 15.57m
[*]OHB: 18.48mChris Hercules (post-grad jumper): 409 points
-
[*]OHB: 19.19m
Gerald Taylor (Junior jumper):
-
[*]30m: 3.74
Kelly Willie (Junior sprinter / Olympian):
-
[*]30m: 3.74
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
Mike,
I’d like you to clarify a few things regarding testing protocols. I assume your 30m FAT’s are used with a Speed Trap II type system, using a touchpad at the start?
On the Standing Long jump, do you do this into the pit? If so, do you allow the athletes to hang their toes over the edge, or have them start from a board/tape line, etc. on level ground?
Thanks for posting those results, it’s very interesting.
-
Keymaster
30m is timed with a speed trap II using a touchpad and timing gates.
SLJ & STJ are performed into a pit (completely level….we bring in officials).
SLJ is performed with the toes curled over the edge of the runway and measurement is made from the end of the runway.
OHB & BLF are performed off of the shot put toe board.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
from the “portland yoda”….
Mrs. K is in limbo mode right now w/regard to training so Mrs Y gets the elite messageboard title belt for now 😉
a few yrs ago i took some of the better LSU Pent scores from the 80’s and 90’s and made a chart of performances that they achieved that spring when the info was available. I havent updated it in about 3 yrs but it still may be useful to some.
If people are interested i’ll post it.
-
Participant
Im interested.
-
Participant
i’ve attached the file
-
Keymaster
Thanks KT…..very interesting. I’ve had it on my mind to do a full out study using our 20 year database of pentathlon results examining the various tests as well as overall pentathlon score with performance on the track as measured by national ranking (from the year end performance list) and NCAA placing. Unfortunately, it’s pretty far down the priority list right now :no:.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
Thanx Kebba. good stuff. Im suprised at Roshann grifens testing results. Just goes to show that you cant put everything in testing results. It isnt alwasy the best predictor of performance.
-
Keymaster
[i]Originally posted by QUIKAZHELL[/i]
Thanx Kebba. good stuff. Im suprised at Roshann grifens testing results. Just goes to show that you cant put everything in testing results. It isnt alwasy the best predictor of performance.True but based on the list, Roshann could be considered an outlier, if you look at the top of those lists, it’s filled with National Champions and All-Americans.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
don’t really have any guidelines for the differential… early in the year it will probably be greater than later…. i.e., after they’ve become accustomed t o doing block starts.
-
Participant
Thanks Kebba, great stuff. I do have one question for Mike or yourself. Are the 30m times listed performed from a 3 pt. start or with blocks? Does anybody have data to suggest what the time differential might be for a 3 pt. vs. block start to 30m? Obviously it depends on how efficiently the athlete uses the block, but there must be a general guideline.
-
Participant
Thanks KT. But I’m still wondering, were those out of a 3 pt or block start?
-
Keymaster
In the pentathlon meet we hold, most everyone uses blocks but they don’t have to if they don’t want. We do however test the 30m at 2-3 other times during the year and we go from a 3 point stance. I actually can’t notice any significant difference between the times.
ELITETRACK Founder
-
Participant
[i]Originally posted by mike[/i]
Dave-
My wife can beat yours……nah nah nah nah nah naaah30m: 4.36 FAT
SLJ: 2.67 into sand; 2.60 onto mat
VJ: 0.73 (~29″)
5 Hop: 12.96m
Squat: 110 kg (242 lb)
Clean: 80 kg (176 lb)
Pullups: 19
Pullups w/ 50 lbs of chains over shoulders: 6
OHB: 13.7mAll at a shade under 5 feet tall and 110 lbs….she’s a beast.
I’ll post more test results later.
I’m pretty sure that Mrs L would not be able to even do most of these test. Some would probably break bones. I think the only thing she could be Mrs. Y at is the height- just a shade over 5′. However, the 1.5 mile run for fitness……..
-
Participant
Mike-
I think I recall you saying elsewhere that a 30m timed with a 1m fly period gives a time in the range of .25 faster than those timed with a touchpad start. I can’t seem to find it right now so I just wanted to confirm with you that this was correct. Also, do you happen to have any records of 30m times from a 1m fly for current or former athletes as well as any of their 60/100m FAT times for comparison.
Thanks a lot
-
Participant
Ian,
Nik replied to a similar question of mine the other day. Suggested doing 30m where you time yourself, starting when first foot hits the ground and stopping when you cross finish.
He suggested about a 0.6-0.70 difference between that and a true “trapped” 30m run.
-
Participant
Ian,
Nik replied to a similar question of mine the other day. Suggested doing 30m where you time yourself, starting when first foot hits the ground and stopping when you cross finish.
He suggested about a 0.6-0.70 difference between that and a true “trapped” 30m run.
Matt- thanks for the reply but I have access to timing gates (just no touchpad to start) so I’d like to see how the 1m fly-in times have compared with touchpad as well as FAT results as Mike seems to have used the 1m fly method with some athletes in the past.
-
Participant
Bump for Mike…
-
ParticipantYeah i’m familiar with this as well…
If i’m not mistaken. Dallas Robinson ran 2 tenths faster with the fly in 1m method than with the touch pad over 30m. I might be slightly wrong.
-
Viewing 58 reply threads
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.