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    ELITETRACK
    You are at:Home»Forums»General Discussions»Blog Discussion»The Blade Runner

    The Blade Runner

    Posted In: Blog Discussion

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 2:12 am #13222

          Oscar Pistorius has recently gained a lot of attention not only for his amazing athletic feats but also for how he is achieving them. You see, Oscar is a double amputee who is the world record holder for the paralympic 100m, 200m, and 400m sprints. Recently he ran in an open (non-paralympic) 400m race in Rome and came in 2nd. He has run times of 10.91; 21.58; and 46.56.Today, he ran in Sheffield a

          Continue reading…

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        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 3:18 am #67978

          IAAF recently overturned their decision to let Oscar and others in his situation run against non-paralympic athletes. They have however recently started conducted secret tests to see if his legs provide him with an unfair advantage. What do you think?

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          gdelia928 on July 16, 2007 at 5:09 am #65590

          i think hes a good runner adn maybe he would be on the scene if he wasn't a double amputee but carbon fiber is significantly lighter than a human leg which gives him an advantage in the final 200 when everyone is struggling to lift for the finish and as the technology gets better his times will drop

        • Participant
          mortac8 on July 16, 2007 at 5:42 am #65591

          Recently overturned their decision?  He ran today in Sheffield.

          I think it would be awesome if they let him run and it turns out he was sandbagging all along and runs 42.  Clearly his kryptonite is rain.

        • Member
          wisconman on July 16, 2007 at 6:31 am #65592

          I read in a SI mag a while ago about how a double amputee, I'm not sure if it was Oscar Pristorius, got legs that made him about six foot six while he was really only about six foot one, when he had legs. I know this wouldn't really help in a 100m, but in a 200 or a four hundred especially it wouldn't it give you a big stride advantage? 

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 7:15 am #65593

          Recently overturned their decision?  He ran today in Sheffield.

          Yep…he (and all other paralympic athletes) was banned until a couple months.

          I think it would be awesome if they let him run and it turns out he was sandbagging all along and runs 42.  Clearly his kryptonite is rain.

          If you look at his PR distribution he definitely gets significantly more competitive the higher the distance. He might be able to run a really fast 800m.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 7:20 am #65594

          One thing to consider is that the issue is bigger than Oscar. While the current prosthetics may only level the playing field (or maybe not even that) it's only a matter of time until prosthetic technology does become a big advantage, perhaps more so than PEDs.

          Also, another argument is allowing able bodies and disable athletes to compete together is that it has the potential to belittle other paralympians, 99.99% of whom could never dream of competing with the able-bodied but are nonetheless great athletes and competitors in their own sub-category of track.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          davan on July 16, 2007 at 9:02 am #65595

          He had a reaction time of >.4–think that maybe his prosthetics don't let him start efficiently enough to run the shorter races? I imagine part of the reaction time is that he is not even able to apply enough pressure onto the blocks to register a reaction with the prosthetics (at least, not register a reaction as fast as able bodied athletes).

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 9:17 am #65596

          He had a reaction time of >.4–think that maybe his prosthetics don't let him start efficiently enough to run the shorter races? I imagine part of the reaction time is that he is not even able to apply enough pressure onto the blocks to register a reaction with the prosthetics (at least, not register a reaction as fast as able bodied athletes).

          I didn't realize that and it's certainly part of the equation but also look at how fast he closes in all of his races….it's amazing. Either he is AMAZING race distribution or the legs somehow reduce the affect of fatigue. He may be slow to get going but once he gets going he keeps going.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          Nick Newman on July 16, 2007 at 4:48 pm #65597

          this guy does not have an advantage in any sense… he does not have lower limbs!!

        • Participant
          mortac8 on July 16, 2007 at 5:42 pm #65598

          No advantage?  That is 'to be determined'.  In one interview he said he just started training 400m for about 8 months and was "obliterating records".  Why can't everyone in the wheelchair 100m get those limbs?  Maybe IAAF just letting him run to stir up some interest in the sport. 

        • Participant
          Nick Newman on July 16, 2007 at 6:37 pm #65599

          i just cant see it…i mean…i dunno do i.

        • Participant
          mortac8 on July 16, 2007 at 6:57 pm #65600

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 16, 2007 at 9:27 pm #65601

          From the AP today:

          IAAF: Pistorius' prosthetic legs provide less air resistance

          LONDON — The prosthetic legs double-amputee sprinter Oscar Pistorius uses provide less air resistance than normal legs, the IAAF said Monday.

          Pistorius, who wears curved, carbon-fiber prosthetic legs, finished second in Rome on Friday and last against elite able-bodied athlete at the British Grand Prix on Sunday. He hopes to compete at the 2008 Beijing Olympics.

          The International Association of Athletic Federations has been reviewing footage from two high-definition cameras that filmed Pistorius in Rome to determine if his prosthetic racing legs give him an unfair advantage.

          "The guy Oscar beat on Friday — the stride length was the same, but the speed through the air was slower for the able-bodied guy," IAAF spokesman Nick Davies said. "This research makes us want to do more."

          Davies said the initial research also showed the way Pistorius distributed energy was virtually the opposite to able-bodied runners. And unlike able-bodied runners, Pistorius was faster at the end of the race instead of the beginning.

          Pistorius ran 46.90 seconds in Rome. But in his first race against an elite field on Sunday in Sheffield, England, he finished last (47.65) in heavy rain and was disqualified for running outside his lane.

          Oscar Pistorius finished with a time of 47.65 seconds in the 400 meters at the British Grand Prix meet and then was disqualified.

          Pistorius has set world records in the 100, 200 and 400 in Paralympic events. To make next year's Olympics, Pistorius would have to run a 46.3 before the July 2008 qualifying deadline.

          The IAAF introduced a rule in March banning any runner deemed to benefit from artificial help from competing, but Davies said that was not necessarily meant to include athletes like Pistorius.

          "Maybe he's overreacting over certain things. He seems to think that we've banned him then decided he was eligible," Davies said. "We clarified the situation. No one has banned him. We want to give him the benefit of the doubt."

          Davies also said the IAAF was not discriminating against disabled athletes, citing legally blind runner Marla Runyan of the United States, who competed in the 1,500 at the 2000 Olympics and in the 5,000 in Athens four years later.

          "We need to separate emotion from the science," Davies said. "We all wish him well. The point here is what's going to happen in 10 years? What happens if it continues to evolve?"

          Davies said the IAAF's research was being overseen by director of development Elio Locatelli, who is a former chief coach of the Italian athletics team, and the governing body of the sport hoped to work with Pistorius in the biomechanics department of the Cologne-based German Sport University.

          Pistorius was born without fibulas — the long, thin outer bone between the knee and ankle — and was 11 months old when his legs were amputated below the knee.

          He began running four years ago to treat a rugby injury, and nine months later won the 200 at the 2004 Paralympic Games in Athens, Greece.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          gdelia928 on July 18, 2007 at 5:51 pm #65602

          i think its easy to see why his race is distrubuted in negative splits, getting out of the blocks with prosthetics has gotta be hard and with those he would be better off once he could increase his stride length.

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 19, 2007 at 10:28 pm #65603

          i think its easy to see why his race is distrubuted in negative splits, getting out of the blocks with prosthetics has gotta be hard and with those he would be better off once he could increase his stride length.

          Also, later in the race the muscles of the lower leg will not fatigue on Oscar like they would on an able-bodied sprinter.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Member
          rice773 on July 20, 2007 at 2:26 pm #65604

          yeah this guy has no lactic acid production from his lower limbs. granted there is something like nine times as much power produced by the hip muscle during sprinting but… if you think about it LA transport to the liver would be much more efficient if your heart didn't have to pump blood from your lower extremeties up to the chest.

        • Participant
          gdelia928 on July 21, 2007 at 7:53 pm #65605

          interesting article on this subject

          https://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/07/11/the-debriefing-olympic-sprinters-should-cut-off-their-legs/

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 21, 2007 at 8:38 pm #65606

          interesting article on this subject

          https://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/07/11/the-debriefing-olympic-sprinters-should-cut-off-their-legs/

          That is an interesting article but I don't think the author understands what the IAAF considers an advantage. To the IAAF, it doesn't matter that he isn't running faster than all the able-bodied sprinters. What matters to them is whether he's running faster than he otherwise would be capable of doing. The answer to this question is sticky and it may be difficult to prove or disprove either way but I think what it comes down to is whether the technological advancement will outpace training advancements allowing people such as Oscar to eventually run faster than able-bodied people.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on July 27, 2007 at 12:00 am #65607

          IAAF & The Blade Runner Agree On Biomechanical Analysis

          Monte Carlo – A biomechanical analysis of the Paralympic champion Oscar Pistorius will be carried out to obtain whether his prothesis gives him an advantage over able-bodied runners, the ruling athletics body IAAF announced on Thursday

          The IAAF said in a statement that the scientific analysis will be carried out by Peter Bruggemann from the institute of biomechanics at the German Sport University of Cologne in Germany.

          According to the IAAF, the test will take place over three weeks, starting not before October 2007.

          The double amputee Pistorius, who runs on carbon-fibre curved blades that simulate shins and feet, was allowed to run against able- bodied runners at the IAAF meets in Rome and Sheffield two weeks ago.

          Video evidence from the Rome race to be used in the biomechanical analysis.

          Pistorius, who aims to compete at the Beijing Olympics next year, claimed after the races that the IAAF was not helping him in the best possible way, but now welcomed the new initiative.

          'I am pleased to be working with the IAAF on conducting the appropriate research so that we can jointly come to a fair and educated conclusion.

          'There is much at stake personally and for the future of all amputee athletes and I applaud the IAAF for recognizing that. By aligning experts from prosthetics and biomechanics I believe we will be able to put this issue to rest one way or the other,' he said.

          IAAF president Lamine Diack said: 'Now that Oscar has improved his times to the extent that he is able to compete in open athletics competitions, the IAAF has a duty to make sure that his prosthetics are analysed carefully. We cannot permit technical aids that give one athlete an unfair advantage over another.'

          The research is to determine whether Psiorius' blades violate the IAAF rule on the use of technical aids in competition.

          The rule prohibits devices that incorporate 'springs, wheels or any other element that provides the user with an advantage' as well as the use of an 'appliance that has the effect of increasing the dimension of a piece of equipment beyond the permitted maximum in the rules.'

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          Eager on March 5, 2008 at 11:21 am #68759

          He’s baaaaaack.

          [code]https://sportal.co.nz/other-sports-news-display/blade-runner-refocuses-on-olympics-44315[/code]

          I recently purchased Bosch and Klomp’s book “Running” through Amazon.com and I followed that up with their DVD “Running”, which I bought from Gambetta’s site. The DVD is one of the most thought provoking presentations I’ve seen, especially where they explain how kinetic energy is stored in the elasticity of the lower leg to greatly increase running efficiency.

          In light of that, while I applaud the Blade Runner for his pluck and I think his prosthetics are seriously cool, there is NO WAY they are not an advantage in maintaining top speed, once that speed is reached. All of Pistorius’ arguments seem to apply to 100m running, where the drive phase is a much larger proportion of the overall event.

          So, should we allow him to try for the 100m? I think not…for one thing, it’s notable that he’s not trying to compete in that event (or the 200m). Beyond that, apples and oranges is what we’re dealing with here. Example: XC skiing is kind of like running, but not. You could look at the equipment and the surface as a kind of prosthetic. Therefore, it’s a separate thing that we don’t categorize as running, despite the similarities. The Blade Runner is doing something, but it’s not running in the same way that others run, despite the surface level similarities.

        • Keymaster
          Mike Young on May 18, 2008 at 9:52 am #69837

          The IAAF has ruled that he can run at the OGs:

          https://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080516/ap_on_sp_ol/oly_run_cas_pistorius

          Pandora’s box is now officially open.

          ELITETRACK Founder

        • Participant
          mortac8 on May 18, 2008 at 9:57 am #69838

          The IAAF has ruled that he can run at the OGs:

          https://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080516/ap_on_sp_ol/oly_run_cas_pistorius

          Pandora’s box is now officially open.

          If he makes it, he will get annihilated which will be extremely entertaining. big ratings

        • Member
          winnesota on May 18, 2008 at 10:42 am #69840

          Bad decision. The dude doesnt have lower legs. Its just common sense that he has an advantage, theres no way around it. Not only does his calves which he doesnt have not get sore/tired, his heart doesnt need to pump blood to the lower legs.

          But it doesnt really matter for this year b/c he wont make it.

          I think I’m going to get some prosthetic legs over my legs and go to the Olympics.

        • Participant
          mortac8 on May 18, 2008 at 5:44 pm #69842

          Pistorious is so awesome that he wouldn’t even make the US trials. Put him in the 8.

        • Member
          winnesota on May 18, 2008 at 9:36 pm #69844

          Pistorious is so awesome that he wouldn’t even make the US trials. Put him in the 8.

          The funny thing is he would probably run a 1:30

        • Member
          wisconman on May 18, 2008 at 11:01 pm #69845

          “no one else is even as close to as fast as Pistorius on the Cheetahs, suggesting that his speed is due not to his technology, but to his speed.”
          Is this a valid point? Other people use cheetahs, but they don’t blow away paralympian world records. Also, a single amputee competed on American Gladiators the other day, and I would say his prostetic did not give him an advantage in the uphill treadmill in the eliminator, but that guy competed with so much heart there was not a dry eyer in the house.

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