Posted In: Blog Discussion
We’ve recently been spoiled by the amazing feats of Asafa Powell’s 9.72 personal best in Lausanne and Usain Bolt’s string of sub 9.85s. So much so that it’s easy to forget that someone other than these two actually produced the fastest 100m ever. EVAR. Tyson Gay. Remember him? He’s that guy who didn’t make the final at the Olympics due to lack of race fitness caused by an injury at the U.S.
ELITETRACK Founder
Thanks for the great analysis. This is why Elitetrack is the best place to educate oneself about our sport. I have been a lurker for years and have gained immeasurably from the content. I think your comments regarding the prelim, when tyson had to attempt to reaccelerate at 90m, was particularly trenchant. Specifically the hypothesis that the genesis of his injury began here. I thought the same, especially in conjunction with his 9.68 final w a 4mps tailwind. Remember what happened to Thompson after his wa 9.69. Tyson’s body/training/recovery apparently was not ready to handle these forces. Looking at Dix, however, I feel he can, with further technical refinement, handle the physiological demands and improve greatly. His top end speed and endurance was not that far behind Tyson’s.
Thanks for the kind words. I agree- I’m very impressed with Dix. Not only is he a ‘gamer’ in every sense of the word but he’s clearly still very raw with a lot of room for improvement.
ELITETRACK Founder
Off topic a bit here, but…
With our young sprint talent, do you think that USATF will somehow arrange/force the issue to win a world title / olympic gold in the 4×100. I would really like to see Dix, Gay and Padgett be able to get on a loaded relay with good handoffs and see what happens.
What order / personnel do you think would give us the best chance?
Mike-
Thanks for taking the time to break it down for us.
I have a couple of general questions.
Is there a way to normalize Usain’s 9.69 to Tyson’s 9.68 to wind and then compare their 60-m times?
and
I’m curious if there is a point at which a tailwind would become detrimental to sprint biomechanics?
Murieka has done some work but on altitude and wind adjustments but I’m not sure they could be applied to 60m without some jimmy rigging. I think it’s safe to say that if Bolt had Tyson’s wind that he would have run about 0.04 faster over 60m.
Many have suggested that a tailwind is detrimental to performance but if this is the case the statistics don’t really back it up. There’s a chance that it negatively affects mechanics but the aiding benefit of the wind seems to more than negate this for almost all competitors.
ELITETRACK Founder
Good videos but I don’t think you can really compare Gay 9.68 vs Bolt 9.69. 4.1 vs 0.0 is a different universe. As for wind not helping much, tell that to FloJo, Carl, Obadele, Fasuba, etc. With 4.1 running through the line Bolt would probably go sub 9.5. Resist being fully sucked into the realm of science.
Yeah….different in more ways than that. Just did it to create an imaginary race between the two. I’d guess under similar conditions Bolt would have run a low 9.5 (if he ran through the line).
I think the “wind hurts” phenomenon stems from a comment Mo Greene once made about it hurting him. As I mentioned the stats don’t bear this out if you look at the fastest 100m times of all time and the conditions people run their seasonal bests in. Wind helps. It’s as simple as that.
VERY fast hurdlers are probably the only short sprint athletes that can actually say that wind could hurt performance.
ELITETRACK Founder
Technical issues w the hurdles arise from the athlete being to close at takeoff. Stride patterns and frequencies become altered. That’s why one should train w “close” hurdles. Mike, In the 100m the deleterious effects of a tailwind would come from the overspeed factor wouldn’t it? Technique may hold but the physiological/metabolic effects could be devastating. What did Pfaff think about this after Thompson’s run and subsequent injuries and hardships?
Hard to say that because he looked so in control and there wasn’t a significant helping wind. Think he still would have gotten the 19.30 w a 9.62 all out 100m win. Plus with his turning in the last 15 m of the one hundred he could have caused significant soft tissue damage imho.
Most athletes when subjected to a tailwind experience hysteresis in the control of their movement. Almost always this is corrected in a race, if it isn’t the athlete will likely fall on their face. From the data it looks like it occurred between 80-90m in this race or was this the result of Gay??? Possibly, the latter, but it also happened to 1/2 the finalist and all in the outside 4 lanes on the track at 50-60m as well.
Do you think that which bolt being so tall that a tail wind would aid him more because of his bigger frame? (help him generate his body to top speed and beyond faster?) i realise that if it would help the taller sprinters more than the shorter ones it wouldn’t be by very much at all (0.01 or so maybe?) I’m just curious as to if it would make a difference or not
Do you think that which bolt being so tall that a tail wind would aid him more because of his bigger frame? (help him generate his body to top speed and beyond faster?) i realise that if it would help the taller sprinters more than the shorter ones it wouldn’t be by very much at all (0.01 or so maybe?) I’m just curious as to if it would make a difference or not
Interesting question, I am thinking it is more of a disadvantage though.
Unless the wind was greater than his speed (30mph), he would have more drag force against his body from more surface area, which would negate any advantage. Most sprinters wear speed suits to create less drag on the front side by not having flapping fabric that can pick up wind.
Which explains why Bolt has ran his fastest times without a speedsuit and Walter Dix still got left in the dust with those “fabulous” arm things 🙂
Does Puma even make speed suits?
Not sure… my point was that I question how much it really matters. Multiple 9.7 guys have run their fast times with loose tops and, in the case of BJ, with shorts even. They’ve also run with average spikes (Bolt, BJ, Mo) and with “super spikes” or high technology (Asafa). There are guys who have gone sub 10 with Rivals (the bottom barrel spikes nowadays). I kind of doubt that those elements really matter outside of appropriate fit, comfort/psychology, and extremes (you obviously don’t want something really baggy or crappy).
Which explains why Bolt has ran his fastest times without a speedsuit and Walter Dix still got left in the dust with those “fabulous” arm things 🙂
Yeah…those things didn’t do so hot for Sanya and Dix. I’m sure they probably helped a very little but but really I don’t think you’re going to make significant (0.03s or greater) by reducing drag as long we’re comparing the range of usual sprint attire (and not a parachute).
ELITETRACK Founder
[quote author="davan" date="1220851818"]Which explains why Bolt has ran his fastest times without a speedsuit and Walter Dix still got left in the dust with those “fabulous” arm things 🙂
Does Puma even make speed suits?[/quote]They have in the past. I’m sure they probably make speed suits.
[EDIT- the evidence is right in front of our eyes. Check out the 5th picture on the home page image scroller. The guy in 2nd is Bolt…in a speedsuit]
ELITETRACK Founder
On a related note, and to bring it back to the original topic, the shorts Tyson and Doc wear (the ones with the power bands) have been shown to improve performance by a significant amount.
ELITETRACK Founder
But Bolt’s fastest times have come with loose tops (9.72, 9.69, 9.77 -1.3, 19.3, etc.) and Tyson ran pretty quick in the normal national suit in Osaka (injury and lack of fitness don’t tell us much from Beijing).
How much of a difference do you think powerbands improve over a speedsuit and a speedsuit over a normal tank top singlet? Talking about in 100m with trained athletes.
But Bolt’s fastest times have come with loose tops (9.72, 9.69, 9.77 -1.3, 19.3, etc.) and Tyson ran pretty quick in the normal national suit in Osaka (injury and lack of fitness don’t tell us much from Beijing).
How much of a difference do you think powerbands improve over a speedsuit and a speedsuit over a normal tank top singlet? Talking about in 100m with trained athletes.
As I mentioned above, I suspect that the speed suits might improve performance by 0.01-0.02 over 100m but much of that could be attributed to the compression aspect of the suit on the legs rather than aerodynamics. As for the power bands, I’ve had a lot of guys run with and without and I’d guess that they’re worth at least 0.05 over 100m. Adidas CLAIMS that they’re worth 2% performance improvement. If that were true (and I don’t believe it fully) that would be worth several tenths over 100m.
ELITETRACK Founder
As for the power bands, I’ve had a lot of guys run with and without and I’d guess that they’re worth at least 0.05 over 100m. Adidas CLAIMS that they’re worth 2% performance improvement. If that were true (and I don’t believe it fully) that would be worth several tenths over 100m.
This would have been nice to know. I will try infant sized powerweb shorts w/ extra power bands along with my powersprints with a prerace meal of power bands coated in power drive then PR by .3
This would have been nice to know. I will try infant sized powerweb shorts w/ extra power bands along with my powersprints with a prerace meal of power bands coated in power drive then PR by .3
This would’ve put you in the sub 11 club. Maybe next season you can get all that gear and then wear some brush pin spikes on your new prosthetic blades and you’ll be able to run under 44.
ELITETRACK Founder
[quote author="mortac8" date="1220922049"]
This would have been nice to know. I will try infant sized powerweb shorts w/ extra power bands along with my powersprints with a prerace meal of power bands coated in power drive then PR by .3
This would’ve put you in the sub 11 club. [/quote]
I can feel the heat from that burn from here.
It would be possible but extremely difficult to get a grasp on how much these variables can affect performance by getting tons of data points and parameters for a given performance and then figuring out how much performance is aided or hurt by these factors. The one’s I’d really like to put numbers to are track surface, altitude, wind, attire, and spike weight.
ELITETRACK Founder
It makes so much sense that Tyson injured his hamstring. Having not seen the trials, I wasn’t aware of how close he was to losing it in the preliminary race. You’re so right, decelerating like that and starting back up would definitely hurt him. It’s amazing how something so small could have such ridiculous impact. It worries me a little about my training. But… I don’t have the acceleration capabilities that Tyson Gay does so if something like were to happen to me, I wouldn’t be hurt, would I?
