[Blivit]

Blivit on May 1, 2009 at 4:35 am #15688

6 workouts, wondering what you might classify them as (tempo, speed endurance, etc.)

Workout 1:
4*30m
4*60m
4*150m
90% effort
Walk back rest in between short sprints
5 min rest inbetween 150

Workout 2:
3×4 100m 12s pace
3 min rest inbetween
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 3:
4*60m
4*80m
6*200m 30s pace
Walk back rest in between short sprints
2 min rest inbetween 200m

Workout 4:
150m, 180m , 120m
3 sets 80% effort
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 5:
6×300
55 sec pace
6 min rest inbetween

Workout 6:
6*30
90% effort
4*350
60 sec pace
8 min rest inbetween

Thanks

[Daniel Andrews]

Daniel Andrews on May 1, 2009 at 5:00 am #82663

6 workouts, wondering what you might classify them as (tempo, speed endurance, etc.)

Workout 1:
4*30m
4*60m
4*150m
90% effort
Walk back rest in between short sprints
5 min rest inbetween 150

Workout 2:
3×4 100m 12s pace
3 min rest inbetween
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 3:
4*60m
4*80m
6*200m 30s pace
Walk back rest in between short sprints
2 min rest inbetween 200m

Workout 4:
150m, 180m , 120m
3 sets 80% effort
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 5:
6×300
55 sec pace
6 min rest inbetween

Workout 6:
6*30
90% effort
4*350
60 sec pace
8 min rest inbetween

Thanks

Something I would expect from a former collegiate athlete who knows little about energy systems and contradictions in training. It looks a lot like a mixture of Clyde Hart and someone who doesn’t know enough.

[Craig Pickering]

Craig Pickering on May 1, 2009 at 5:40 am #82665

That wasnt really constructive was it? People come here on for advice, and stuff like that doesnt help!

[Blivit]

Blivit on May 1, 2009 at 5:51 am #82666

Well you are right with some of it; it is from a former US collegiate athlete who is now professional (non US.) He is a 200/400 runner but was not trained by Hart. He is a friend of mine here in Florida and has been helping me get back into shape.

[quote author="Blivit" date="1241132769"]6 workouts, wondering what you might classify them as (tempo, speed endurance, etc.)

Workout 1:
4*30m
4*60m
4*150m
90% effort
Walk back rest in between short sprints
5 min rest inbetween 150

Workout 2:
3×4 100m 12s pace
3 min rest inbetween
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 3:
4*60m
4*80m
6*200m 30s pace
Walk back rest in between short sprints
2 min rest inbetween 200m

Workout 4:
150m, 180m , 120m
3 sets 80% effort
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 5:
6×300
55 sec pace
6 min rest inbetween

Workout 6:
6*30
90% effort
4*350
60 sec pace
8 min rest inbetween

Thanks

Something I would expect from a former collegiate athlete who knows little about energy systems and contradictions in training. It looks a lot like a mixture of Clyde Hart and someone who doesn’t know enough.[/quote]

[Blivit]

Blivit on May 1, 2009 at 5:52 am #82667

It’s all good, I’m not bothered by it. I am still curious what others might think.

That wasnt really constructive was it? People come here on for advice, and stuff like that doesnt help!

[mortac8]

mortac8 on May 1, 2009 at 5:56 am #82668

https://www.nacactfca.org

see slide 67 of the “Coaching Sprinters” link

[Daniel Andrews]

Daniel Andrews on May 1, 2009 at 6:02 am #82669

It’s all good, I’m not bothered by it. I am still curious what others might think.

[quote author="speedfreak1" date="1241136664"]That wasnt really constructive was it? People come here on for advice, and stuff like that doesnt help!

[/quote]

Blivit:

I am working right now and will explain later the contradictions I was talking about. Only one of those days I could classify as you explained. I don’t mean any disrespect to your friend either as I was calling it how I saw it. It’s something I would have used several years ago.

[RussZHC]

RussZHC on May 1, 2009 at 6:18 am #82670

I understand Daniel’s comments…the slide Mortac8 mentions is pretty complete…

the trouble spot, for me personally, is that with workouts # 1, # 3 and #6 there is a mixing of “types” within a workout…I am not saying it can not be done, for sure as
Mike Y. has mentioned elsewhere there is some “bleeding through” of exact times, adjacent energy systems etc., but in # 1 for example there is near one end of Speed (short) and the longer end of Speed Endurance…it may get done if circumstances “force” it but as a whole I don’t mix those two on the same day and overall the result, with three workouts having a similar vein (mix) is then something that tries to do all things rather than each thing very well.
To me, with an adjustment in total distances run of each type and in each session (plus recovery etc. etc.), there are actually 9 sessions there, not 6 and moving towards 2 weeks worth of work (depending on the time of year) rather than what I suspect is a week?

[Daniel Andrews]

Daniel Andrews on May 1, 2009 at 6:36 am #82672

That wasnt really constructive was it? People come here on for advice, and stuff like that doesnt help!

Despite your assessment, I found out what I wanted to know to best give him help as I will later.

[burkhalter]

burkhalter on May 1, 2009 at 7:09 am #82673

You could have been nicer about it. You were, at one point, at the exact same knowledge base.

[Daniel Andrews]

Daniel Andrews on May 1, 2009 at 7:29 am #82677

Its wasn’t meant to be nice or mean, but a way to gather information.

[trackspeedboy]

trackspeedboy on May 1, 2009 at 9:46 am #82687

6 workouts, wondering what you might classify them as (tempo, speed endurance, etc.)

Workout 1:
4*30m
4*60m
4*150m
90% effort
Walk back rest in between short sprints
5 min rest inbetween 150

Workout 2:
3×4 100m 12s pace
3 min rest inbetween
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 3:
4*60m
4*80m
6*200m 30s pace
Walk back rest in between short sprints
2 min rest inbetween 200m

Workout 4:
150m, 180m , 120m
3 sets 80% effort
8 min rest inbetween sets

Workout 5:
6×300
55 sec pace
6 min rest inbetween

Workout 6:
6*30
90% effort
4*350
60 sec pace
8 min rest inbetween

Thanks

workout 1: accel. training + speed endurance (split runs + 150s) + somewhat of a lactate threshold workout

workout 2: intensive tempo

workout 3: split runs (SE) + extensive tempo

workout 4: borderline extensive-intensive tempo work

workout 5: extensive tempo

workout 6: accel. training + extensive tempo

Mainly these workouts are building up a aerobic base + speed endurance from the split runs (sprints with walk back recoveries).

Why not do something like this….

5x20m
5x30m
100% speed
full recovery in between

2x4x60m
100% speed
5 mins rest in between reps/8 mins rest in between 2 sets

3x3x60m
100% speed
5 mins rest in between reps/10 mins between sets

6x80m
100% speed
8-10 mins rest in between reps

5x120m
100% speed
12 mins rest in between reps

80-100-120-150
95-100% speed
full recovery

4x150m
95-100% speed
15 mins rest

10-20-30-40-30-20-10
1-4 mins rest in between
full speed

2x200m
running at PB pace
full recovery in between
(increase distance to 250m next workout and then 300m after)

3x350m
near pb pace-slightly faster-full out PB pace for last one
full recovery

2x3x150m at 80% speed
1 min rest in between reps/full recovery between 2 sets

300m + 100m
PB pace 300m – rest 1 min – sprint 100m

6x120m at 85% speed
3 mins rest in between

4x100m-3x200m-2x100m-1x200m
75% speed
50m walk recovery in between reps

6x FEF (30m sprint/20m float/15-20m sprint)
full recovery

6x flying 20m
full recovery

4x FEF (sprint 50m-float 50m-sprint 50m)
full recovery in between

100-120-150-180
full speed
full recovery

[Daniel Andrews]

Daniel Andrews on May 1, 2009 at 1:20 pm #82698

Workout 1: Works the ATP-CP system but doesn’t stress it until the last couple of reps probably with the short sprints, it stresses the lactate system. It’s a mixture of short speed endurance and speed endurance (150).

Workout 2: Is intesive tempo for everyone but a world class sprinter, in fact its probably too fast for most sprinters unless you are running them in 12.9s hand timed.

Workout 3: Is short speed endurance/speed endurance/tempo endurance all mixed into 1 workout.

Workout 4: Is a mixture of a simulation workout presumably for 400m and probably tempo endurance.

Workout 5: Is tempo endurance at would be mile race pace most likely for a sprinter (4:52 mile) although for a long sprinter I don’t think its enough thus making it extensive tempo or active rest. Read Aaron Springer’s Training Log

Workout 6: Is a mixture of short speed endurance and tempo endurance at a pace I would give to an 800m runner and a distance I would do an event run or special endurance 2 run with a 400m runner but with more rest (15-25 minutes) and faster pace (ie near race pace for 400).

With this said 1 of the workouts I think is worthwhile and I will take note of it (#1). The others I don’t think highly of. My belief is it’s ok to mix short speed endurance and speed endurance, speed-endurance and special-endurance work during simulation or modeling work which is what workout #1 would be really effective for running rounds during competition.

My suggestion would be to keep the workouts focused on 1 theme during a training session. In my opinion tempo endurance, with the exception of some intensive tempo work is general training and should be treated as such. Just as I think max strength and power work is more like specific training for sprinters and should be treated as such.

A couple of guidelines I use

1. Never mix general or specific training or short speed endurance with tempo endurance or extensive tempo
2. You can mix speed and special endurance with about anything, but if you do it should be a way to model or simulate.
3. Intensive Tempo should be a lead into special endurance work as the season progresses.

[Blivit]

Blivit on May 2, 2009 at 1:12 am #82715

Daniel, thank you for the detailed response. I need to spend some time now reading that.

[ex400]

ex400 on May 2, 2009 at 1:39 am #82717

Blivit — I find it hard to relate to some of the paces (e.g. 12 sec 100, 30 sec 200) without additional info.
How old are you? What are your PBs in 100/200/400?

Were these 6 workouts proposed for 6 consecutive days or just sample workouts that might be done over the course of a season?

[Blivit]

Blivit on May 2, 2009 at 1:57 am #82719

Blivit — I find it hard to relate to some of the paces (e.g. 12 sec 100, 30 sec 200) without additional info.
How old are you? What are your PBs in 100/200/400?

Were these 6 workouts proposed for 6 consecutive days or just sample workouts that might be done over the course of a season?

I am 29 and getting back into running after being away for 11 years. The 100’s I am not able to complete in 12s I will say that. The only times I have were from ~11 years ago and were ~11.2/100, 23/200 and 51/400. I am nowhere near that right now.

What I did was ask my friend for workouts he has done in the past as he runs the events (200/400) I am working to do as well. So, I would say these are just sample workouts for now.

I just started running these workouts probably 3 weeks ago. Prior to that I had no structure. I ran these workouts not consecutively then took a week off to help heal my shin splints (which started before these workouts) and now am running every other day doing one of these workouts each one of those days.

[Mike Young]

Mike Young on May 4, 2009 at 1:50 am #82794

Those are some unusual workouts and really blend many different speed and energy systems together in to single workouts. On the ones that at first glance appear to have true speed work (with the shorter sprints), if you look at the rest intervals you’ll see that there’s no way that the athlete could be running very fast for more than 1-2 reps because the rest interval is insufficient to permit quality work. That’s a good and bad thing. Good in that it actually makes the workouts a little more consistent than they first appear but bad because they may be using means and methods that are not the best to achieve the desired result.

ELITETRACK Founder

[jesims]

jesims on May 13, 2009 at 1:48 am #83268

this is an interesting discussion. thank you for sharing 😉
simulation rachat de credit

[katherine04]

katherine04 on May 22, 2009 at 3:49 am #83687

😛